My Valentinian II

The top one is mine. It's identified off the reverse in the bottom one. The mug on mine appears to be more youthful-looking. I don't know what I'm doing, so, I'd like: (1) the catalog description; (2) the "kindergarten version," if you will, of same. Thank you.

 

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Valentinian II, Antioch. 378-383 A.D.

Obv.: DN VALENTINIANVS PF AVG, helmeted, diademed, draped, cuirassed bust right, holding spear and shield.
Rev.: GLORIA RO-MANORVM, emperor standing on galley, head right, raising right hand, Victory seated at helm. T / Cross // ANTΓ.

It's going to be listed in RIC IX, but I don't have my books handy at the moment.

 

John, thank you, that's how I'll describe it, but it's still all Latin to me. I wonder if we can take it out of the scholarly tongue. This looks like a babe, does it not? Also, can you explain the symbolism of the two types of crosses on the reverse? I know this is the Holy Roman Empire. If they're both representing crucifixion crosses, I believe the cross on the left is of the earlier type they used.

 

The "cross" in the left field is a "T" rather than a cross, while the "cross" in the right field is actually a cross representing Christianity. At the bottom of the reverse is the mintmark ANTΓ. The ANT means it was struck at Antioch, and the Γ is the Greek letter Gamma representing the particular shop where the coin was made. I hope I helped explain a little.

 

I figured the top cross was the Christian cross. I know they crucified on the T-square cross, too, that's how I had that one figured. Do you know what the "T" represents, then, Bing?

 

Not "Holy Roman Empire", that is the much later medieval Germanic realm. This is still the ancient Roman Empire. By the time your coin was struck the empire and the imperial family (not to mention many in the empire) were officially Christian.

 

Yeah, I hear you, that's right. I'm still hung up on that "T."

 

Shoot.....never took you for a 'dark side' type Eddie. A recent foray?

 

I'll try anything once, lol.

 

Hear ya brother.......I once tried Brussels Sprouts.

 

Et tu, Ken? I love brussels sprouts!

Back to my young boy, here. I have to know what that "T" represents.

 

The meanings of most of the field marks on Roman coins are unknown, but it is clear that they represent some sort of internal organization. The Romans were very exact about record keeping, but unfortunately none of their mint records survive. Perhaps T stands for tertia? Perhaps the coin was part of the third emission of the third shop? You would have to ask an ancient Roman.

If you're going to collect ancient coins, sometimes you just have to embrace the mystery. But perhaps someone with more knowledge of this series, like Doug or Warren, will step in and clarify.

 

Yeah, what he said!

Sorry. I can't help you with the T. I just accept it as part of the coin. I have many coins with field marks/letters. Most I have no idea what they may have represented. Of course, you could do what Steve does and just make it up as you go along (only kidding little brother).

 

Well I'm home, so I pulled out RIC IX and scanned the page on which your coin is listed. This takes a bit of explanation...


Your coin would be properly referenced as RIC IX Antioch 59b, mint-mark 2. In the Obverse column, 1a refers to the legend DN VALENTINIANVS PF AVG. J2 means Junior bust with rosettes on the diadem. (Valentinian II was a teenager when this coin was minted, so he gets a boyish portrait.) In the Rarity column, the coins with this mint-mark are considered scarce. Your mint-mark is #2, and one example examined by the authors of RIC belongs (or belonged) to a certain Gotha collection.

I haven't found any reference as to the particular meaning of the T, but I'll keep digging. I hope that helps.

 

John, if you boys knew, and I didn't ask, I'd be kicking myself. Now that I know you don't know, embrace this mystery, how do you even know it's the letter "T." Again, they used T-square crosses.

I'm just asking. I don't know any ancient Romans to ask. I knew Frank Sinatra, but it's too late to ask him.

Seriously, how are you deriving it's the letter, not the cross? Maybe that's what I need to know, your rationale.

EDIT: That helps a lot, John! Thank you!

 

We know it's a T simply because T is part of the Roman alphabet. Occam's Razor - usually the simplest explanation is the best. However, Romans used a variety of symbols to represent Christianity, like the cross and chi-rho, but the crosses always have the top bar. And the use of letters as field marks goes back to pre-Christian times. All of that basically adds up to the letter T.

Do you want a breakdown on the legends? The Romans used abbreviations extensively on their coins.

 

Just as an example of what JA is explaining, here is a coin from Constantine II with different field marks, but still letters:

CONSTANTINE II
AE Follis
OBVERSE: FL CL CONSTANTINVS IVN N C, bare-headed, draped, cuirassed bust right
REVERSE: PRINCIPI IVVENTVTIS, the prince in military dress standing right, holding globe and spear, F-T across fields, mintmark BTR.
Struck at Trier 317-8 AD
3.2g, 19.5mm
RIC VII 173

 

John, the T-square cross was the pagan crucifixion cross. It's the cross that's lower in imminence, here. The Christian cross is raised above it in imminence. That's why I thought those both were crosses, the pagan and the Christian. Nothing better than it sounded good.

In the bottom reverse, compare it to the "T" at the bottom of that reverse. It looks a little like that, I have to admit.

 

Ah, I see, Bing. Thank you.

 

Symbolism. The subject is facing the Christian cross. He's guided in battle by the Christian cross. Behind him is the pagan crucifixion cross. They're leaving behind paganism for Christianity. Do you see? But nonetheless it does look like that "T" at the bottom of that second reverse, I have to admit.