[ancients] Even more Postumus

These are the 3 Postumus coins I mentioned buying in a recent thread. They aren't the $8 and $12 bargains that Doug and Mat showed in that thread and cost me on average about $21 a piece postpaid. Apart from demonstrating that I'm more of a Tetricus than a Trajan when it comes to dominating the bargain coin scene, I think it probably also goes to show that I need to buy fewer (Postumus) coins.

Anyway, I'm curious to know what you guys think of them. I can't say I'm a fan of the even black color and glossy surfaces of the Jupiter and Pax coins. I would be surprised if they were natural and in general I much prefer the gray billon coins of Postumus. In hand the "dark patina" of those two coins seem to suck in all the light and make the details hard to see. I do think they photographed quite nicely though, and I especially like the portrait of the Jupiter coin.


POSTUMUS
Antoninianus
2.38g, 19mm
Cologne mint, 268 AD
RIC V 311.
O: IMP C POSTVMVS P F AVG, radiate draped bust right.
R: IOVI VICTORI, Jupiter standing right, hurling thunderbolt and holding sceptre.


POSTUMUS
Antoninianus
4.22g, 23mm
Trier mint, 268 AD
RIC 318.
O: IMP C POSTVMVS P F AVG, radiate, draped & cuirassed bust right.
R: PAX AVG, Pax standing left, holding transverse scepter in left hand and olive branch in right hand; P to left.


POSTUMUS
Antoninianus
3.4g, 21mm
Trier mint, 267 AD
RIC 329.
O: IMP C POSTVMVS P F AVG, radiate, draped & cuirassed bust right.
R: SERAPI COMITI AVG, Serapis standing left, raising hand & holding sceptre.

 

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I would guess the difference between the $8 and the $21 coin is more who was selling. I have paid $8 only to people on eBay who are not known to many bidders and do not attract competition on their very ordinary coins. Nice strikes with good surfaces are certainly worth $21+. From CNG, the coins would have drawn even more simply because there are people who will buy their coins nowhere else. Postumus' coins are an interesting group including coins easily worth hundreds and others that bring next to nothing. I wonder if we all agree on which is which.

 

I've had a few coins darken considerably during treatment of bronze disease. Maybe that's the origin of your coins' patinas?

 

Regarding color: I always believed that the brown Postumus coins were later and the gray ones had more silver and were earlier with billon/porous ones lik your Serapis in the middle. A recently posted link to a site dividing them into issues contradicted this but the fact remains that some types are usually gray and other types are brown/dark. Compare my two like the above Pax and Serapis. My photo makes the dark pax lighter than it is.


There are exceptions including Moneta which I believe was issued more than once. We see the same thing in Gallienus whose metal was being debased continuously at the same time. You might find your IOVI VICTORI in lighter brown but I doubt you will get it gray. The color looks like a hoard that was batch cleaned and retoned as is common with these huge hoards that have been found.

Conversely, there are types that are usually gray so you will have more trouble finding them dark.

I'm sure none of this as is simple as I've suggested here but I also doubt that your black coins are bronze disease survivors. I know a dealer with several of the coins with COS dated reverses. All are dark and shiny. Perhaps they came from a hoard with your pair??? I have not seen one of these with silver color but that does not mean they do not exist. Such things require serious studies by real scholars with access to the huge hoards. Such people tend to work at the British Museum and the like but don't hang around CT, unfortunately.

 

I don't see anything wrong with the color of your coins, Z. However, I do understand just how tough glossy black coins are to photograph. As Doug said to me in another thread, you're not photographing the surface of the coins, but rather the light reflected off of it, and you've got to decide how much white you're willing to allow into your definition of black.

I realize recent scholarship has revised the chronology of these coins, but RIC makes a point that is still quite valid. Trade between the Gallic Empire and the East continued unabated, despite the schism. When the Eastern Antoniniani began to drop in fineness, the Western had to follow suit to prevent the trading of good silver for bad. Otherwise, the Gallic ants would have all crossed the border, never to return.

My recent acquisition came in at $40. The reverse is average for the type, but I was ultimately drawn to the fully-struck portrait with superb style...

 

Thanks for the replies, Doug, TIF and JA,

I'm inclined towards Doug's suggestion that these were batch cleaned and retoned, and considering these still regularly turn up in metal detector finds, it may be standard cleaning/retoning SOP.

You're right, I think I've only seen one with patchy silvering remaining.

I actually didn't have much problem photographing them and am satisfied with the photos (I hasten to add I don't have very high standards ). The problem I have is that the details are hard to appreciate looking at the coin itself because it's so dark. While I'm slightly bothered that I like the coins in the photos better than the ones in hand, at least I've got the photos!

 

A natural hat-trick!! ... I actually really like your new dark/black additions (I think that they're "macho-tough" lookin' coins)

I'd post my Postumus Prow coin, but even I'm getting a bit sick of seeing it!!

 

Okay fine => if you insist!!

 

Glad you read my mind

 

Personally I like all three. I only own four in total, none of which are near as nice as these new coins of yours:

 

Whaaat? I'd happily buy all four of yours, except as already noted I need to buy fewer Postumus coins .

 

I have one from a large mixed lot,



And another which was an inexplicable purchase at this year's WFOM. It was among a group of coins purchased late in the afternoon after skipping breakfast and lunch. I generally don't collect coins of that period and I already had Postumus.

 

TIF: is that BD on the first coin?

 

Looks like it. I don't recall if I treated it after this picture. I'll get it out and check.

 

Meals are such nuisance during shows. I think the best solution is to carry around an IV drip.

 

If it is BD, it's definitely a coin worth treating. That variety of Providentia seems much scarcer than the other one you have and from what I can see much more valuable :
http://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=1581525

In any case the second coin is interesting too for the unusual portrait and the globe looking more like a bat or crab.

 

That's a shockingly high price! Is that particular acsearch example just an anomaly? Hmm. I will certainly check this coin for BD today. Usually I treat any suspect coins immediately but my treatment methods have changed since buying that lot.

Edited: I checked for others on acsearch and you're right... the type does seem to bring a considerable premium.

 

It's the only way with get detail to show with some coins.

 

Yeah, I know. This is one of my ornery ones...

 

:/ another pain to photograph