Is it possible that the ground has given up an extreme rarity?

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by PensacolaCoins, Oct 8, 2014.

  1. Treashunt

    Treashunt The Other Frank

    Apparently threads were removed.

    For the OP:

    In two words:

    Good Luck!

    But, (hold on folks) I have to agree with Doug.

    I have a feeling that it is simply a contemporary counterfeit.

    Produced in base metal, or very low grade silver content.

    As mentioned by Doug, the 'test marks' say a lot
     
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  3. BooksB4Coins

    BooksB4Coins Newbieus Sempiterna

    Rarity does not always equal extreme value; if it did many patterns would be trading for many multiples of what they do while even the tougher Morgans, Lincoln or Merc "keys" would be flat. With that said, I stand by my assessment. The coin, IF it were genuine, would most certainly be valuable, but just not six figures valuable, especially in this condition.
     
  4. BooksB4Coins

    BooksB4Coins Newbieus Sempiterna

    A quick overlay with a know genuine example, the date on the OP's example is too far left (and slightly high as mentioned by Condor). This alone, and beyond any other concerns, would indicate that the "coin" is simply not genuine.
     
  5. Dougmeister

    Dougmeister Well-Known Member

    @GDJMSP, who do you think put the "test punch marks" on it if it is fake? The counterfeiter or people who were trying to determine the authenticity?
     
  6. PensacolaCoins

    PensacolaCoins New Member

    So, a question. What *should* it weigh, given the wear and damage, if it is a genuine coin?
     
  7. Dougmeister

    Dougmeister Well-Known Member

    Wikipedia (I know, not the *best* resource...) reports the mass when minted was supposed to be 26.73 g with a diameter of 38.1 mm. I guess it is non-magnetic?
     
  8. PensacolaCoins

    PensacolaCoins New Member

    It is non-magnetic. That I can confirm. The diameter also appears correct. The grading companies won't encapsulate counterfeits, even if they are originals from the era, will they?
     
  9. Mike Reynolds

    Mike Reynolds New Member

  10. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    ICG will slab them, as a counterfeit, for educational purposes.
     
  11. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

  12. Mike Reynolds

    Mike Reynolds New Member

    or another similar die from the Orient
    try heating a pin or needle and touching it to the coin
     
  13. rickmp

    rickmp Frequently flatulent.

    And the purpose of this 'test' is . . . ?
     
  14. Peter T Davis

    Peter T Davis Hammer at the Ready Moderator

    Lead has a lower melt point. I assume that is what he's implying.
     
  15. Mike Reynolds

    Mike Reynolds New Member

    won't hurt it if it's silver
     
  16. BooksB4Coins

    BooksB4Coins Newbieus Sempiterna

    Even though a quick and imperfect job, perhaps this will add to the points/observations made earlier.


    1853 no arrows LS 50C date overlay.jpg
     
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  17. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    No idea, but they are not recent. That does not mean they were not done in modern times though. Other than our small dollars coins of recent years copper is the most reactive of our coinage metals. And even a year or so in the ground would darken test marks. Don't forget, it was found in the ground.

    Is it possible it's a contemporary counterfeit, yeah sure. Just as possible it is not.

    But a quick trip to any jewelry store to weigh it will answer if there is any possibility of it being genuine. That is the first step.
     
    Mike Reynolds likes this.
  18. Mike Reynolds

    Mike Reynolds New Member

    that's a whacky looking date! looks like my dime.
     

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  19. desertgem

    desertgem Senior Errer Collecktor Supporter

    Are we still discussing the 1853O half? Weight = 13.36 grams and 30.6 mm +/- tolerances.
     
  20. BooksB4Coins

    BooksB4Coins Newbieus Sempiterna

    These numbers should sound familiar to you, but not for an LS half.
     
  21. PensacolaCoins

    PensacolaCoins New Member

    I looked in the red book and PCGS for the correct weight, etc. 30 mm and 13.36 grams. The diameter does measure up, but not sure about the weight just yet. I'm assuming if genuine, it will be slightly under 13.36. I guess one thing would be for sure, if it's over weight then there's no way it's real. Are the old/new counterfeits typically under weight?

    I have also noticed that 1853-O with arrows and rays is only supposed to weight 12.40 grams, which is the opposite that I thought would be the case. Does that sound right?
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2014
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