Worth reporting this Ebay account?? STAY AWAY!!!!

based upon that conclusion, I would say that if the market is willing to pay $ 50 for steak, then that is what it is worth and those who sell steak for $ 10 are under-valuing the product.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

Well things are a different quality (at least sometimes) if someone is paying $50 for steak they are likely expecting it to be of a higher quality than a $10 steak.

 

If the buyer doesn't take the time to educate him/herself, can you really claim they are being taken advantage of in this situation? No in my opinion.

 

Not always. I bought some GAP jeans at a GAP outlet for under $5 (clearance rack). Those same jeans would cost $50+ in an expensive market GAP store. Those that pay more do not shop around, have money to blow, or whatever. Same jeans, different prices. The store selling the same jeans for $5 are just selling to a different market. If they prices the jeans at $50, I would not have bought them. This seller is trying to go for the customer who has money to blow, and who might think an expensive coin is somehow better than the exact same coin priced for less.

 

.

 

There is legal and there is ethical. As I posted in another thread it is illegal for a coin dealer to tell someone (in the state of Nevada) their $5000 coin is only worth $50 and then buy it at $50.

It is also illegal for a coin dealer to tell a customer that a $50 coin is worth $5000 and then sell them the coin. While it is relatively easy to prove the first example it is much harder to prove the second. Is the coin toned and worth twice market rate? Did the cac sticker raise the value 80%? Would it sell for the asking price within ten years on ebay?

I believe there is an ethical limit not otherwise specified where you do cross the line from ethical to immoral.

My experience that while we could debate percentages that most of the time either the dealer is reasonable or is trying to pull a fast one.

For example,

I personally think this example is unethical. Selling a coin that would resale for under half the asking price. I cropped the name off because I'm not trying to call anyone out with this example. So the title and grade on the coin missing but it is a 1881 s S$1 ngc ms 65 cac.



Even if the coin graded 66 the ask in the gray is $300. You can tell me buy the coin not the plastic ect all you want this is my personal belief and morality. If someone asked me if this is ethical I would say no.

I honest believe in my own nonlawyer personal belief that this example goes beyond unethical and I personally believe this sale would violate Nevada law.




Photograde shows this as the pcgs example of ms67.




I know I post this example a lot but in this case were I on a jury I believe that this sale would meet the below definition .


You have someone relaying on the dealer to honestly represent the coin and this dealer is selling a coin that would be an example in any of the articles on coin fraud and third rate tpg scams. The dealer is omitting the fact it is priced at pcgs levels and even a pcgs ms66 sells only around $70. Further there is the false representation that this coin really is a ms67. Maybe the police would never arrest this dealer. Maybe no jury would convict but there really are two lines in my opinion. There is the ethical/unethical and the illegal. And in my strict and personal opinion this second example represents the illegal. This is a $20 coin being sold for $499.99. In any court if there was a state appointed expert (one not receiving a check from the defense) I believe they would never say this coin was worth the price nor properly represented.

I believe that while legal it is unethical to offer someone $50 for a $5000 coin if you don't misrepresent the coin and just say something to the effect of "I'll give you $50 for that coin". I understand if you are buying a raw coin from a customer and there is a $50 to $5000 jump with one grade buying the coin at $50. But a pcgs/ngc slabbed coin has measured value and getting this one wrong would bother me. Again there are examples where the coin could be over graded that one point and you again don't want to take the risk. But outside extreme examples I do believe most coins fall into the realm of easy to define ethics.

These are real life examples. Everyone is entitled to their opinion and maybe I just have a higher expectation from others. Doug can tell me I can't judge until he is blue in the face and bleeding from typing trauma this is my belief and defination of coin ethics and I'll judge the situation as I see fit. I don't get to throw anyone in jail I am not a professional judge but this is my moral standing. And I have had a table at a show and do have a small taste of what it is like on the dealer side even if it was only for three short days.

 

Vegas Vic-

What exactly do you think determines those values that you are quoting? Here's a hint: it's an average of what people have been willing to (freely)pay for such examples. I'm glad I don't live in Nevada, because I don't need government thuggery looming over me in the decisions I make as a buyer or a seller.

 

Lol most if not all states in the United States have laws against fraud. So if you live anywhere in the United States you are most likely already held to this standard. Intentionally misleading or lying about any item is
Not considered acceptable behavior in most first world countries as well.
Feel free to do this in a third world country so you can find out people react to this behavior there. And please let me know how it works out for you.

 

fraud
noun \ˈfrȯd\
: the crime of using dishonest methods to take something valuable from another person

: a person who pretends to be what he or she is not in order to trick people

: a copy of something that is meant to look like the real thing in order to trick people

 

http://www.leg.state.nv.us/NRS/NRS-042.html


https://www.leg.state.nv.us/NRS/NRS-205.html#NRS205Sec380


I would rather follow the definition of the word fraud by the law rather then relay on online dictionaries but to each their own.

 

Listing a coin for more than it is "worth" is not a crime, or unethical. If you corner someone, lie to them about it being a guaranteed investment opportunity, have high pressure sales tactics, etc, then maybe. But simply posting a coin with a high buy it now or best offer? Harmless in my opinion. You have to be stupid to not research what you are buying. You do realize there are a TON of way overpriced things in this world, right? By your standards, every jewelry seller should be thrown in jail. Most diamonds are really not worth hardly anything, and most jewelry is sold for WAY over what it is actually worth.

 

I listed my definition of unethical vs illegal. I don't care what you are selling if you are charging well beyond what is the standard market retail price by my set of personal code of ethics is unethical. Jewelry has a market value way more difficult and is not standardized the way a pcgs or ngc coin is.

 

Of course you would! You want the government to nanny you. I take responsibility for my own decisions.

 

So you are telling me that if Walmart sells a bottle of Coke for $0.99, the 7-11 is guilty if they charge $2.99? I bought a 1948- NGC MS66 Lincoln for $18.00. Therefore, the last 15 sellers on eBay are guilty because the least one has sold for was $34.30? If that is what you are try to say, I want to live elsewhere!

 

Oh, come on. Even hard-core libertarians (who probably favor small government more than you do) agree that one legitimate function of government is to enforce the "no initiation of fraud" principle.

IMHO, "you want the government to nanny you" is getting into the "personal attacks" area. How about a deal: I won't click "Report", and you "take responsibility" for keeping the argument on a more mature level.

 

It is the definition of "fraud" we are disagreeing with. Fraud to me is selling a 1922 Lincoln with the MM removed as a 1922 No D. Selling a whizzed Lincoln as a problem free MS coin. Your asking price for anything cannot possibly be fraud.

 

Please refer to my definition of fraud. I posted it for a reason. Compare and contrast it to the seller in the OP's original post. After you do that, you can then have a conversation with libertarians about how much they do or do not favor government.

 

I have only voted republican and libertarian. You have no real idea of what views I have and I would appreciate no further

I do however that traffic works best with traffic lights. And you can't just drive 110 mph down a neighborhood street. But I was disgusted with New York City banning soda.

 

Fair enough. I'm still going to give you hell for voting republican though.

 

Speaking of soda, we all know you can get a large cup at McD's (at least here) for $1. If I go to a ball game, and they charge $8, should that be illegal?