To me,slabbing is a rubbish practice,as is the 70 point grading system.If someone offered me a coin in a slab,I would base my price for the coin,not the slab! Aidan.
I'm not big on slabs either. It is a service of some value though when so many coins are cleaned or otherwise messed with, not to mention out right faked. To many people do seem to 'buy the slab' as opposed to looking at the coin itself.
Aiden: While I agree with your feelings, the fact that the big TPG'ers guarantee the authenticity of the coin is a relief in many instances. For example, I have seen probably about 4 1901 S Barber quarters in thelast year on eBay that were bogus. So, there are good points to everything. And, yes, buy the coin not the plastic.
If I was offered a slabbed coin,I would break open the slab,& transfer it over to a decent holder,as slabs are far too bulky.The exception applies when the slab is an official mint slab,such as the 1/20 Oz. platinum $5 Koala from Australia.It comes in a slab around 1 square inch across.It was struck at the Perth Mint,but there's no logo on the slab.I bought it based on its platinum value.The same thing applied to the platinum 10 Kina from Papua New Guinea with a butterfly on the reverse (buying it).The 10 Kina didn't come in a slab though. Aidan.
Authentication only!!! As far as grading and all these rediculous labeling scams....... ever here the phrase "snake-oil salesmen"!
I don't like slabs much either. I have a Morgan in an NGC slab, and it just makes me mad that I can't actually hold the coin.
the 70 point system might be crap. But it is because there is a 70 point grading system that we need slabbers. PCGS has been grading coins for about 20 years. Their graders have seen lots of coins: enough to be better graders than the average collector or small-time coinshop owner. If I need money and have to sell my coins, I dont want to be wasting time and money running around from dealer to dealer trying to get the best grade, and thus best price. In a PCGS holder, 8 or 9 dealers out of 10 will agree with the PCGS grade. The top three graders are recognized as grading authorities and their slabs save a lot of hassle. If any of you are in South Florida, then you might know Ron Steinberg. Ron told me in europe they have three grades: poor, average, and near mint. Let's stay on topic and avoid inappropriate language.
Here in New Zealand,we use the good old-fashioned 7 point grading system.I have heard that the Canadian notaphilic community flipped when a 70 point grading system & slabbing was attempted for grading Canadian banknotes.Can anyone from up in Canada please confirm this? Aidan.
I personally like slabbing. I feel that reputable TPGs offer a valuable service. When a point or two in grade difference means a big difference in price, I like to have the opinions of professionals as well as my own opinion to go by. I feel that this is particularly valuable when buying coins over the internet. However, it is very true that you should buy a coin for the coin, not just the holder it's in. As for the point system, the 70 point system is fine to me. Of course, I've never known any different either. I think 100 would be too much and 7 is not enough. So, there you have it...my opinion, humbly submitted.
For those who like slabs because they believe they will not acquire a cleaned coin utilizing that method, I believe that you are under a false impression. I strongly recommend that you carefully read their websites, as they make no such claim. The "top" tpgs discuss various types of cleaning, but they only claim to not slab the "harshly" or "improperly" cleaned ones. But it is known that they will slab those as well, if it suits them.
I think slabs can be usefull for someone like me who has limited experience with determining the difference in the MS grades. As long as I don't have to pay much of a premium I will buy a coin in a pcgs or anacs or ngc slab to make me feel more comfortable with the grade. Once I get the slab I break out the captive and put it in a Dansco so my collection is displayed nicely and I can get to the coins. Without these slabs I would be much more hesitant to spend the money. As my grading experience grows I am buying more raw coins but I like the verification that the top TPGs offer.
For some coin i will have to say i Like the slabs. Not so much for the point grading system but for the extra protection they offer your coins. I have some circulated silver coins that I love to play with and hold in my hand. At times i just like to flip them and I do love the thud sound silver makes when it lands on a table. As many of you know the silver anniversary sets were really not that secure in their mint boxes. When I opened one of my sets, a reverse proofs fell out and roll across the floor. This is one time that I was glad I did not hear that silver "thud" when it hit the floor. Now this is a capsule and most would not call this a slab but I was glad something was between the floor and my coin. I have a very few what i would call expensive coins and all of them are in either a pcgs and Ngc holder. I like to play with these coins also but i can not imagine these coins not being in a protective slabber. The thought of dropping one of these coins and it popping out of some capsule just is to nerve racking for me. Grading an the point system is here to stay. As eveyone one knows the 70 grade sells for a singnificant premium over a 69. Right or wrong, like it or not, that is a fact. Take at the first strike , first release first whatever. With all the information out there, these things are still selling for a nice premium over the "regular release". There are people who have money who are willing to pay extra for that little something special as they see it. I hope I am never in a position to have to sell my coins but in that event, I hope they are still around. This is just this newbies opion.
Ford or Chevy Alpine or Kenwood Lift it or Lower it Brunettes or Blonds Chocolate or Vanilla Etc.. etc... I myslef like slabs for several reasons... 1st, I do try to support the local guy, he just doesn't have the selection that the Internet or Ebay has... It makes me feel safer to buy a slabbed coin, sight unseen... Pics can be doctered or switched... They stack nicely I don't worry about them poping out, glue,etc... Easier for me and frinds to hold'em and not muck'em up... I think I'll have an easier time selling them for more if I ever try to sell...
I can see the reasoning for slabs and can even in some cases appreciate it, but overall I woudnt go out of my way to buy one, I think it makes the coin a impersonal object and to me coins are personal (if that makes any kind of sence LOL) De Orc
I like slabs for authentication and protection against harshly cleaned coins. I don't see a problem with the 70 point grading system. However, I do see a problem with people's reaction to the 70 point grading system. I think it makes people lazy, complacent, and encourages them to overpay for coins by giving the illusion of precision to a subjective judgment. Once the slab has that "MS65" on it, people will sometimes pay multiples of the price of a coin in the "MS64" slab. This is madness since coin grading is basically an analog and not a digital experience, if you know what I mean.
The next thing we will hear is that the mint wil have a grading (NGC) at the mint ready to grade for the mint. Next to the grader will be the guy from Coin Vault
the coin vault dude really beat them to the punch with with the presidential coins. I can just imagine all those people who payed big bucks for these coins and see them in their banks in a few days.
TPGs When you have a year like 2006 20th anniversary, it could afford an in depth deception when so much money is to be made. You may send in a rare specimen for authentication and know you got probably the same coin back. People have trusted with no way to verify ASE and AGE sets for grading. IF a dealer sends in a few hundred sets and indicates a percentage should probably be PF 70 do they cater to those wishes ? Do you get back the coins you sent in ? Are some or all of your sets pooled in to grades ? If yours come back PF 68 or PF69 how do you prove those coins were the coins you sent in. You have a receipt with a number on it, that only means it identifys you have sent coins to be graded. There is no means to verify other then their word you got back what you sent in. THAT is a lot of TRUST to place when profit is involved. This is just the kind of thing ENRON did to a whole lot of people, take their TRUST and misuse it. Nothing could be ever proved because the industry is small,and a cover up could be put in place almost immediately. Because of gaping holes like this I would never use a TPG except to possibly authenticate a coin and maybe not then. I have read that it is cheaper to buy slabbed coins in the grade you want it is cheaper in the long run. In the long run they control the industry. " Fist Strike, Early Mintage, One of many .
I do believe tpgs have value as authenticators, and I can see using them for establishing a grade for big $$$ coins (although I am not impressed by the consistency/accuracy of any of them), but it seems to me so much of the slabbing is done in the name of greed. With exonumia, many of the reasons for slabbing that possess some level of validity with regular coinage, pretty much lose that value in regard to tokens. Only an extremely small percentage of tokens are counterfeited, and most of the older token fakes were made back in the day to use in commerce, not to pull one over on a collector. Most of those were cast, and pretty easy to spot anyway. With Civil War tokens, I would estimate ebay has 2-6 fakes per year on average, with most sellers describing them as fakes. Exonumia has not embraced the Sheldon scale at all. The only ones who seem to use it are those folks selling token slabs. No reference or pricing books use it that I am aware of. The old fashioned G, VG, F,...Unc grading system is used. Some price lists only give a price without any grade designation. So many tokens are so rare that coindition really doesn't matter, the fact that it is what it is determines the value, not its condition. Cleaning is virtually a non-issue, and even severe damage such as holing, scratching, bent, etc. may only reduce a token's value by 10 or 15%. Those types of problems certainly don't require an "expert opinion" to reveal. As far as protection, there are as good or better methods of protection available at a fraction of the cost. Not to mention the cwt identification skills displayed by the tpgs is that of a rank beginner, with mistakes being commonplace (when NGC slabs first started appearing on ebay, IMO about 10% were misattributed - they do better now, but still far from perfect). And their grading? I should figure out how to post pics and start a guess the grade thread. I think many of you would be very surprised. So what real value does that leave an exonumia slab? That of a selling tool I suppose. A piece of plastic that's basic function is to bring a higher selling price. These were not well received when first appearing on ebay. In the first batches, I saw many an MS-something Civil War token slab that did not even attract an opening bid of $0.99, even though the token may have been worth hundreds. Unfortunately, that has changed. To me, exonumia strips away the secondary "values" of a slab, exposing the primary one. I can think of no other reason why someone would slab common circulated cwts, other than expecting to recoup slabbing costs and then some upon its sale. With regular coinage that feature may be clouded by other "virtues", but who has not seen a great deal of slabbed coinage and wondered why?
