How is it possible for a 1750s Spanish 8 reales to have no toning at all, in any grade? This doesn't look natural to me. Comments? http://www.ngccoin.com/certlookup/index.aspx?CertNumber=3119815-008
First of all, it's Mexican, struck at the Mexico City mint. It might be a shipwreck coin, where the environment certainly discourages toning. I don't understand your comment, "...in any grade." This piece is MS-61, no toning, no big deal. Keep in mind that toning is a contaminant, silver sulfide, on the surface of a coin, and the color varies with the thickness of the sulfide layer. No silver sulfide, no traditional toning.
It would be in a details slab if the coin was cleaned. Not all old silver coins are toned, that's the bottom line.
I would disagree with this. All silver coins will tone absent modern packaging. If any coin 70+ years is bright white, its a guarantee its been dipped at a minimum. Silver is highly reactive, and will tone very quickly with exposure to the atmosphere. There is not a shred of doubt this coin was dipped. Now, the only thing a TPG is saying by giving such a coin a grade is that the dipping is market acceptable. Being slabbed and graded is not saying a coin has not been dipped, its saying the condition the coin is in right now is market acceptable condition. We could have arguments all day long as to whether this is right, but that it the truth of it.
Yes, I would say it's been more recently dipped as well. Also, shipwreck coins will have surface erosion unless they were recovered a few years after the wreck.
When I click on the link you provided this is what I see - Even though I can't see the coin you're asking about, it is not at all unusual for Spanish colonial coins to have been dipped. So that would explain the no toning you are asking about. As for silver coins in salt water, a shipwreck coin in other words, salt water turns silver coins black. So just about any shipwreck coin you see has been treated/dipped/conserved in one way or another to remove that black coloration. As for shipwreck silver coins all having corrosion, yeah most do. But there are instances where they do not even if they've been there for a couple hundred years or more.
I can't seem to get the photo to load...so I can't see the coin. That said, assuming no toning is present...the only way that is possible is the toning has been removed. The coin has been cleaned in some way to remove the toning. There are several ways to safely clean (conserve) a coin. Toning results from natural oxidation of the coin's surface over time. Silver coins this old will have some kind of toning to them if they have not been altered.
Did you read what it says ? It says no coin with that number found. And I just did it again, says same thing.
Sorry, I didn't see that part from your screenshot. The first couple of times I did it, it looked identical to your screenshot, but if I scrolled up it showed a VERY bright silver 8 reales. Way too bright, like they overdipped it yesterday. Maybe all of the clicks on the coin has shortcircuited the NGC site?
Sorry about the link - it works from this end. The point I was trying to make is that it looks REALLY unnatural for a 250 year old coin to look like it was minted yesterday. The only thing I can think of is that it must have had some horrible toning to make someone dip it. I really would have liked to have seen it before it was 'conserved'. I'm not sure the value in this case was increased by 'conserving'?
You never know. Perhaps the toning was very unsightly...or worse yet, had progressed to the point when it was going to start causing damage to the coin. Plus, there are a lot of people out there who love blast white coins...as unnatural as it may be. FWIW, I generally agree with you...but on the other hand, it is kinda neat to see what the coin originally looked like.
Yes, we will never know. I agree though it may very well have been done to protect the coin. People forget toning is a progression to corrosion, and if left unchecked and store incorrectly toning will destroy a coin. There are quite a few silver coins I am not ashamed to admit I dipped. I would do it again, because they were too far gone and would have been corroded had I not dipped them. Still, I would have let this one mellow a bit before slabbing it. Too bright, hurts my eyes.
