Now thats a guarantee

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by mrbrklyn, Jan 13, 2007.

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  1. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator


    Neither of these marks belong there. Perhaps the upper one might be considered as a light scratch. Either way I agree, the coin is not deserving of a 66.
     

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    GDJMSP, Jan 15, 2007
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  3. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator


    Walter, look at the pics of the coin I posted. The first pic is what the coin looked like when it was first slabbed - that's the whole point. The coin did not turn in the holder, there was no improper storage - it looked like that from the day it was slabbed. So yes, PCGS grossly overgraded the coin. David Hall used the story of improper storage and the coin turning in the holder to cover his backside.

    Before the first Heritage auction ever even took place, pictures of this coin, in the slab, were published on the coin forums. It caused an uproar in the internet coin community. That's because those carbon spots, the discoloration, and even what appears to be wipe marks were on the coin the day it was slabbed. And then when it sold at the first auction for over $39,000 it created an even greater uproar.
     
    GDJMSP, Jan 15, 2007
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  4. Speedy

    Speedy Researching Coins Supporter

    That is what I thought he was talking about Doug---but most of the Cents I've seen have those same marks...

    Speedy
     
    Speedy, Jan 15, 2007
    #23 + Quote Reply
  5. walterallen

    walterallen Coin Collector

    Great Information

    Thanks GDJMSP for putting this story into the proper perspective, telling it straight. It is things like this that really support my dislike of the whole grading service thing. I keep hearing and agree with "buy the coin not the slab", but when TPG's specially PCGS do something like this I think it sends the opposite message. A greedy collector with any knowledge of coins would have to know that the coin we're talking about could not be a PR70 and therefore the high sale price is for the slab or better what the slab is saying and not what the coin apperence is saying.

    Great article for coin club. I plan to share this one.
     
    walterallen, Jan 15, 2007
    #24 + Quote Reply
  6. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Speedy my friend I stand corrected as to the mark directly below the lapel cut. Suffering brain cramps I guess :eek:

    The only other thing I can think of that he was talking about is the light scratch indicated by my upper arrow.
     
    GDJMSP, Jan 15, 2007
    #25 + Quote Reply
  7. Speedy

    Speedy Researching Coins Supporter

    ;) I thought I was missing something because in most cases I'm a mile behind!
    Most of my Cents are in my Wheat Cent collection and don't grade really high and so I didn't know if maybe I was seeing things!

    Speedy
     
    Speedy, Jan 15, 2007
    #26 + Quote Reply
  8. mrbrklyn

    mrbrklyn New Member


    That's an easy mistake to make because I believ that the element has been enlarged by a scratch. The coin looks like it was scraped in general in my eyes. It might, however, just be the light. If you look as a better exaple, the devise is not usually so deep. Or maybe the die is just worn.

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    [​IMG]
     
    mrbrklyn, Jan 15, 2007
    #27 + Quote Reply
  9. huntsman53

    huntsman53 Supporter**


    GDJMSP and Speedy,

    I thought that Ruben was referring to the scratch or Die Crack (I can't tell which) on Lincoln's chest directly below the "1" in the Date! Also, like you stated in your last post, there is definitely a sratch running more or less Eastward from the end of the design element of Lincoln's coat lapel (indicated by your upper arrow).
     
    huntsman53, Jan 15, 2007
    #28 + Quote Reply
  10. mrbrklyn

    mrbrklyn New Member


    There are so many to choose from...

    Ruben
     
    mrbrklyn, Jan 15, 2007
    #29 + Quote Reply
  11. Speedy

    Speedy Researching Coins Supporter

    I think the reason the coin that we are talking about looks funny is that maybe that was a new die and the detail was really sharp---therefor the marks would look more like a dent or such.

    Speedy
     
    Speedy, Jan 15, 2007
    #30 + Quote Reply
  12. mrbrklyn

    mrbrklyn New Member


    I thought that at first but I changed my mind. Its dull and hence the last of detail such as the more subtle laple marks in the photo of the 1913 above. As it dulls, it cracks and flattens, or at least that is my theory.

    Ruben
     
    mrbrklyn, Jan 15, 2007
    #31 + Quote Reply
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