ANACS certification... If fake, they might keep it?

ANACS is only protecting itself by returning a coin "questionable authenticity". How many have they actually turned over to the Secret Service? Obviously, "questionable authenticity" means "fake without a doubt, but we don't want to get involved".

 

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The Federal Court rulings on counterfeit coins and the confiscation of contraband are very well established in US history. If you own contraband, and the government learns of it, they (government) have both a right and a duty to confiscate it. Failing to do so undermines the value of the realm's coin. This concept is so old it dates back to the days of Caesar and the feudal kings and emperors that followed.

Prior (old) US Federal court rulings have opined the presence of 3 or more counterfeit coins in one person's hands is sufficient 'Reasonable Grounds' for an arrest to occur with the charge being counterfeiting.

That being said, practical realities enter the picture. Both the number of Secret Service Agents with nothing better to do, and the number of court cases & prosecutor time involving Counterfeiting cases authorized for each year as set by the Attorney General is low.

What this means to you is you run an Ebay ad selling a single counterfeit dime at a low cost, say $1, the SS Agent or office to whose attention this is brought has to weigh the severity of this against the guy they know of who is making hundreds of color copies of $100 dollar bills and passing them at the 7-11. Not only does the counterfeit $100 bill case look easier to prosecute (intent, identification of his color scanner printer, closed circuit camera images from the store security camera of him buying a pack of gum with the fake bills, etc.), not only is it more attractive as a case ('cause remember the Agency has to interest the prosecutor in taking the case and a judge signing the warrants), not only is the $100 bill case causing greater economic harm to the community at large, but the agent is probably also thinking how this will look on his performance appraisal when the boss reviews how he did this past fiscal quarter. The long and short is you will probably go the end of a Round Tuit list with just one or two computer database entries made into Epic's and other Treasury Dept. computers. Not even an NCIC entry yet.

Develop a history of selling counterfeit coins, this will probably change. Have 10 or 20 coins of that type start popping up around the country, yeah, an Agent will probably visit you, maybe even do a search (counterfeit currency according to various Federal court rulings comes under the exigent circumstances exception) to see if you have any more, and also try to find out who you got them from.

Even museums have had counterfeit coins (or unauthorized currency, i.e., Liberty coins) suddenly seized by the Secret Service. Counterfeit US coins and currency are always subject to confiscation. That is the reality. Check US Postal regulations. I seem to recall a prohibition against the mailing of contraband or dangerous items. LoL.

 

Okay to delete.

 

Evidently a member didn't notice a preceding post was deleted and a warning in post #20, so points given and next time will be a time out! Yes we mean No Politics!!

 

You go to a store, and use a $20, $50, or $100 bill to pay for a purchase. They mark it with a counterfeit detecting marker, and the color of the mark determines the bill is not real. Upon holding the bill up to the light, there is no watermark or security strip visible. The store calls the police, they question you and determine you had no knowledge the bill was fake when you passed it to the store. By your theory, the store should return the bill to you?

In reality, the police will confiscate the bill and you're out the money.

This is no different.

 

Apologies for that. The post was still there when I wrote the reply. I think I was typing while you deleted.

 

Shhhh. Don't tell ANACS that Daniel Carr is selling seriously altered coins..........

Oh wait, ANACS already knows this but grades and encapsulates them anyway.


Carry On!

 

You mean like all those 69-S Doubled Die coins the Secret Service destroyed?

Yes, some were counterfeit but some authentic specimens were also destroyed.

 

I have witnessed this very thing first hand.

It was a phony $10 bill at a Taco Bell. The store would not return the suspect bill for examination by "me" so we insisted that they call the police. After all, who would have ever thought that some teenaged Taco Bell cashier would even know what a "fake" looked liek and what would prevent them from simply "saying" it was fake without offering "proof" it was fake?

The police came, determined it was indeed a fake and let me examine the note.
Sure enough, you could see a little bit of the original whate paper that the note was printed on.

BTW, I would have LOVED to have had that note.

 

points? I just noticed i have 83. Is that bad or good?

 

Points given as warnings are on profile as "warning points" as I think you well know
Otherwise we would have banned you 8 times over.

 

I'd have no worry sending in a coin that could go either way . I'm sure they'll just send it back with the questionable authenticity label to cover their backs legally or in a slab . At least I've never heard of them not sending a coin back . JMHO

 

True, it is the banks and the Federal Reserve in particular that are the price setters of the currencies and commodities such as metals (we hardly have any free market system to speak of anymore). The Treasury only issues the money but they are equally accomplices in being derelict of their responsibility to produce enough honest money (gold and silver coin as stated in the U.S. Constitution). Congress is supposed to control our money supply. Governments don't own the money supply today, the "legal tender" so called "money" of today is owned by a private for profit bank.

Common Law is relevant to all who are Americans by definition under the U.S. Constitution.

The only reason the courts no longer recognize most common law was due to the transfer of power from the People to the banks in 1913 and in 1914 came WWI and the Armenian/Greek/Assyrian/Russian/Ukrainian Genocides. So much good the private banks have done for human civilization and good progress. They didn't even bankroll Tesla despite his brilliant idea to provide free electricity. End the Federal Reserve, restore sound money, the U.S. Constitution and rule of law.

To all Moderators: This discussion is quite relevant as it deals with our money and coinage. Please respect my opinions of history with regards to our process of money issuance.

 

I am just now noticing I have 28. Durn if I know when/where I picked them up. I think it would be polite to privately message someone when points are assigned so we would know we did something wrong. How many are we allowed? How does it work, and what is the appeal process?

 

We try to allow some leeway , but you are a guest on this site, and the owner has established rules which do not allow political discussion. He even established a off-site forum for such discussions for members to move off , but they DO NOT occur on this site. Please respect his rules and opinions. My Warning stands~ No political discussions! Thank you.

 

SuperC, those are your trophy points from other members , not warning points from the moderators. You are currently at 0 for that.

 

LOL!

 

Tom (Edison) could never allow that. Too bad George (Westinghouse) wasn't more flush with funds at that time........

 

Oh. LoL! You mentioned points, and then I noticed the screen thingie said I had 28, so I thought I had accidentally broke a rule. Relief. I am shutting up now and slinking back into my cage with embarrassment.

 

I got 98 points I guess I'd be long since banned if they counted good thing I gotta type all this even tho I'm not good at it within 2 minutes of me talking I'd probably be banned for life