My LCS submit coins for me, to NGC. They combined my coins with someone else. I was there when the results came in, and what I found interesting was the other guys submission. They told me so and so is going to be pissed. His results were .10 1916 D Altered Mintmark .01 1909 S VDB Added VDB .01 1914 D Added Mint Mark .01 1922 No D Mint Mark Removed and a couple other Damaged coins. I was wondering how this guy came across this many altered coins. The guys at the coin shop told him they were all no good, but he insisted on submitting them. Maybe this guy is trying to pull a scam?
Yeah, he probably knew they were all phony so he pooled them together and sent them in hoping at least one would pass as genuine.
Seems like there's a lot of paranoia! Is this guy a shill bidder? Is that guy a scammer? But, then again, even a broken clock is right twice a day. Who knows! Personally, I'd be crushed.
More than likely he was a victim of a scammer. I don't think anyone who knows they have fake or altered coins would think a grading service would grade them. A simple case of buying what you dont know then refusing to believe youre wrong. Hard lesson learned, sounds like.
I'm not paranoid, I could care less. I find it odd, that someone could strike out on every submission.
I imagine the other person is a price buyer rather than a quality buyer. This happens to price buyers much more often, in my opinion.
I don't think he is a scammer it is much more logical he bought "grandpas old collection i found in attic" from so random seller off ebay, local or craiglist !! He paid a pretty penny and then could not accept it when the dealers told him they were fakes so he submitted it hoping the dealers were wrong !!
People often underestimate the skills of coin metal workers. If one could actually produce dies ( in reverso ) by hand, how hard would it be to modify soft metal in coins. Filling holes, altering dates, making or removing mm. I expect a wave of Computer controlled micro machining alterations to attack anytime, if not already here as it becomes more common.
How ? It's pretty easy to understand how if you realize just how many altered coins there are out there. There are lots of them, and that's an understatement ! In many cases, especially for those particular coins, there are more examples of fakes and altered coins than there are examples of genuine coins. If you could examine all of the collections of raw coins held by average collectors you would be hard pressed to find even 1 collection that did not have at least 1 fake and/or altered coin in his collection. And most of them will have several. And almost all of them will be unaware of it. If anyone finds that hard to believe then they should consider this - 80% or more of all raw coins in collections are problem coins of one kind or another. And yes that (problem coins) includes fakes and altered coins. Now you can scoff and refuse to believe that, but if you do you do so at your own peril for it is true.
That's the truth. I know a very experienced dealer who sent off 3 AG-Good 1916-D mercury dimes to NGC earlier this year. Two came back "mintmark altered," as in someone changed the S into a D. The other came back "mintmark added." This dealer is no fool. He told me he "wasn't sure" about the one that came back mm added, but he did not detect the altered S to D mintmarks.
I have been slowly learning this hobby at my leisure. I inherited my fathers collection, and had not a clue what it was all about. I couldn't even have told you what the half dollar from 1960 was called. It has been 2 years and I have cataloged, sold some of the silver, and proof sets, and some other misc coins I had no interest in. I have learned this hobby, and spent countless hours on this site, reading, reading books on grading, and value. On my journey I have visited a few LCS's and met quite a few people at a few places I have stopped. One person stands out. He is a 70 year old man who owns a LCS. He has been collecting for 50 years. He has given me boatloads of advice, and helped me whenever I stopped in there. He told me, IF I EVER GET INTO COLLECTING, OTHER THAN THE COLLECTION THAT I HAVE, TAKE CAUTION, THERE ARE MORE FAKES, ALTERED COINS, DAMAGED COINS THEN THE REAL THING ON THE MARKET. He said there have been more fakes that came in his store than the real thing in the past 10 years. I do not have any plans to start collection myself as of yet, but that was a great piece of advice I got from a good person.
