1/4 Eagle Mystery Coin (ID Help): Error, Forgery, "Test Strike," or...?

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Curtis, Sep 28, 2013.

  1. Curtis

    Curtis Well-Known Member

    I don't know much about this, so please excuse me for saying anything particularly ignorant. I collect ancient coins almost exclusively, but I have a couple boxes and bags of American and World coins that I bought 20-25 years ago. One in particular is puzzling to me:
    [​IMG]
    (full size below)
    It appears to be an 1843-D Liberty Quarter Eagle strike, except the flan is not gold (it does have some gold-toned patches around the periphery). It's ~18mm and weighs ~2.15 grams. The flan appears to be tin, zinc, or some alloy (perhaps it was gold-plated at one time to pass off as a $2.50 coin?). I purchased it from a bargain bin at a show, where it was described as some kind of unknown mystery coin. The first coin dealer I brought it to told me it was an error, and that the coin was struck on a silver dime flan in error (the diameter is about right, but it seems to be about 1/4-1/5 gram too light to be a silver dime flan from the time).

    Later I showed it to a dealer specializing in tokens and exonumia, who told me it was a "test strike": Before minting coins for official circulation, he told me, it was typical to test strike them on tin or other base metal flans.

    Does anyone have any idea what this is? I find it a nice conversation piece (no one's given a confident ID) and want to know more about it, but I also wonder if could be of any value (I doubt I'd sell it unless it was outrageously valuable, but I'm curious).

    Thanks for any help!
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  3. Curtis

    Curtis Well-Known Member

    Is this a Pattern Coin? Someone just mentioned this to me and that they are, in fact, collectible. This one is rather worn and beat up, so if that's what is, would it still be worth anything (i.e., should I take care with it, rather than leave in my box of mixed old American coins)?
     
  4. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    Most likely a contemporary counterfeit.
     
  5. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator


    That is a possible explanation yes, maybe even the likely explanation. But proving that's what it is would be pretty difficult.

    Off metal strikes were certainly not unheard of and many mints did produce them. But as a general rule few if any of them would ever survive to find their way into collections. Back when I was still collecting coins with a focus on gold ducats I ran across this coin in an auction -

    1782 oms ducat obv a.jpg


    1782 oms ducat rev a.jpg


    The auction catalog listed it as previously unknown off metal strike of the 1732 Hieronymous gold ducat. The coin was not listed as existing in any book or catalog. I bought it.

    A few years later I ran across another example of an off metal strike for this coin -


    1782 oms ducat obv b.jpg


    1782 oms ducat rev b.jpg


    - I bought that one too.

    The point is these off metal strikes do exist, there just aren't any records of them being made most of the time. When records can be found they are sometimes called patterns or test strikes and written up in the books on the subject. This makes them much easier to sell and much more valuable. They can exist in base metals, copper, even silver. But whatever the case some people find them eminently collectible, even desirable, and others do not.

    Just another case of chocolate and vanilla.
     
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  6. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    I would put it in some type of holder to protect it.
    Can't hurt.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2013
    Curtis likes this.
  7. Curtis

    Curtis Well-Known Member

    Thanks all for the detailed responses!

    Note -- aside from my coin, GDJMSP, your off-metal strikes are quite a remarkable addition to your regular collection of gold ducats! That's very cool (especially to have found two)!​

    GDJMSP, I've been getting feedback from others arguing strongly against it being an off-metal/pattern strike (undocumented variety in the pattern catalogs, which your coin(s) address; and the poor strike and wear, which your second coin shows, but seems unusual for a mid-19th century US coin). I'm trying to weigh that against evidence for it being a contemporary counterfeit (especially the traces of gold plating).

    Most responses I've heard argue for counterfeit with plating. I'm not familiar with counterfeits other than fake ancients, but it seems remarkably well made. I would assume it's struck, which would indicate stolen dies, I think, since I don't see any evidence of casting.

    I kind of like a combination scenario, however improbable: It's an off-metal "pattern" strike that some stole sometime in the 19th century and electroplated with gold to create a counterfeit... I suppose that would be a lot of effort for a thief to go through to make a quarter eagle.

    Perhaps I will start search for examples of $2.50 Liberty forgeries and see if I can find any others (they wouldn't have made just one).

    I paid a rather trivial amount for it, and I'm willing to pay NGC another service to give me an opinion. I wonder, though, if they determine it's a counterfeit (and thus illegal for a private individual to possess), do they keep it? Are they likely to have this same debate and just send it back as unidentifiable? I suppose I'll check the FAQ before sending it in!
     
  8. Curtis

    Curtis Well-Known Member

  9. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Given that your coin does show signs of color it's also a good possibility that it was a plated or gold wash counterfeit. The thing I find unusual is that there is so little color left on the coin. Typically they will look more like the one you linked to in the Stacks auction.

    Either way, it definitely not illegal to own a counterfeit so there are no worries there. The only way you could have a problem would be if you tried to sell it as a genuine coin.
     
  10. Curtis

    Curtis Well-Known Member

  11. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    Why would being struck imply stolen dies? Countr feters have been creating their own dies for striking fakes for centuries. Yes a lot of fakes are cast, but they tend to be rather crude. Better counterfeiters, and those trying for a larger volume of fakes create dies and strike them.

    Considering that only Philadelphia made patterns and the coin in question has a C mintmark I think we can disregard that idea.
     
  12. Curtis

    Curtis Well-Known Member

    Thanks.
    Right, so I've learned. I didn't realize counterfeiters were capable of striking coins at that time, but I've come to understand it was common enough. (My past experience with forgeries has been in researching fake ancients, which are more often cast, rather than struck in high volume productions, since no two are identical and they are immediately recognizable as fake.)

    Yes, I agree that the pattern theory (suggested to me by a professional coin dealer long ago) is bunk. Clearly I'm not especially familiar with these, but I think you meant D not C for the mintmark, right (unless I'm missing something)?
     
  13. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    Your not I am, i's a D.
     
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