Hello everyone! My grandmother informed me that she had a few "very old pennies " that she found while cleaning out her old safe. As she was handing me the coins, I quickly identified them as large cents . Immediately, the possibilities started racing through my head. As I further examined the large cent, I saw the 1804 date. I really can't explain in words how excited I was to be holding such a rare date. She also gave me a beautiful, chocolate-brown 1794 liberty cap. She said that she had more of them hidden in the cellar somewhere, but she gave these to me for now. I brought the 1804 to my local dealer to get his opinions. He concluded it was real, and offered me $400 on site for the 1804. I would never sell it, but I think he was low-balling the offer. The 1804 LC is an honor to own; but honestly, there is just something about the 1794 liberty cap that I really love. The eye appeal is truly a beautiful. If anyone has Sheldon information on either coin, it was be greatly appreciated; however, I think I can narrow it down for the 1804.. LOL
Congratulations lucky boy D dang, the only us coin my grandma gave to me was a 1952 dime. Still priceless Keep it for memories
Congratulations! First, the 1794, has been a favorite of collectors for over a hundred years. Some even specialize only in 1794. I'll link you with one such collection at the end of this message. In your case, the extra curl below the primary thick (normally) bottom curl immediately points to two rather common (for a 1794) varieties which look very similar. The S-30 and S-31. Both the obverse and reveres are similar but different on these varieties unlike some which share either the obverse or reverse. Close examination of the top hair strand and the sharper angle of one part of the hair indicates S-31. Examination of the Reverse and particularly the ER spacing confirm the reverse S-31 attribution. I always do independent examination of obverse and reverse hoping for a new mule and thus new variety. You will also notice that it is heavier than the 1804 and has ONE HUNDRED FOR A DOLLAR followed by a leaf pointing up as are all 1794s other than a few which use the edge of 93 at the beginning of the year and errors. The 1804 is broken down into subvarieties by die state. It is the only year for which this is done since subvarieties usually involve edge distinctions. But still, your 1804 is S-266a or the early die state. It is more common than the S-266b (die break and cud on the obverse only), but far less common than the S-266c (die break and cud on both obverse and reverse). Here is a link to the Boka Collection of 1794s: http://www.1794largecents.com/1794/collection.htm
Marshall beat me to the attributions and he is correct on both According to Breen S-30 and 31 share the same obverse (And it is the same obv as 38.39,40 and NC-2 but those four are in a later state with the bottom curl polished away.) The position of the right wreath stem definitely nails it as S-31 and not 30. I was pleased to see that the 1804 appears to be completely genuine and looks like S-266a. And the dealer was lowballing you.
Very nice! Can't wait for you to see what else she has if this is just a sampling. Keep waiting for someone to give me an 1804 cent.
I have to go with Sheldon over Breen on this one. The hair is different on two or three locks. Perhaps this was an early experiment with softening, re-engraving and re-annealing of the die which could account for the differences which cannot be accounted for by simply polishing the dies. But I'm at the limit of my numismatic speculation and wandering off toward a wild guess. If a die is re-engraved, is it really the same die? Perhaps this is the crux of the matter?
I am one of those collectors that really likes the 1794 dated cents the best. It was a busy year for cents with many varieties - as opposed to a small production of cents in 1793. To the OP, take Gram out for dinner and let her know she is the best.
Are you sure the dealer was low balling him on the 1804? From the pictures it looks to have some issues and I would put the grade at AG-3. And $400 is still higher than the last grey sheet I purchased. I am not knocking the coin, but from a dealer perspective I think $400 might be fair. Of course if the coin is problem free then yes I would say maybe it was a little low - but not low balling low. Just curious how you are pricing this out. Now on the other hand that 1794 looks all original to me.
Hello everyone, Thanks for all the replies. Man, there are truly some experts on these boards - so I thank all of you, special shout-out to Marshall and conder, you guys are a wealth of knowledge. To my astonishment, my grandmother has a LC collection, ranging from the 1794 and 1804 I posted, all the way through 1857. Apparently, The coins she found in the safe were coins that fell out of the wooden glass case all of her large cent collection was in, and relocated to her safe. My guess is whoever put them there wanted those particular coins separated from the collection. So whats this "wooden glass case" large cent collection i'm talking about? Unbelievably, my grandmother had a wooden case of large cents that her "great grandfather" collected, with the large cents pinned down in the box with "yikes" nails. Before you get to excited about what is contains, I want to point out that there was a 1799 large cent in the box. It took me about an hour after I saw the coin before I could utter a comprehensible sentence. Here is the bad news. After regaining consciousness, I removed the coin and immediately could tell that it was a fake. I looked at it carefully and it became obvious by the weight and discoloration that it was a lead fake. That really was the only disappointing part of today. She basically has the whole large cent series! excluding a few dates, she has them ALL. I put the coins back in the holders (the ones in the safe) so you can see the coin-collection in it's entirety. So what do I do from here, I am overwhelmed at what my grandmother has really ? She likes them in the holders they are in now, but they are held down by nails. That makes my skin crawl a little bit, but in a way, it's a family historical item and the way they are displayed are pretty neat. The possibilities here are endless. Any suggestions would be welcome. In the mean time, enjoy the collection. ! -coinmedic
There's no way to examine the coins without removing them from the display. At best, you could get an ID on the obverses with a good close up photo. Removal without damaging the coin will also be a test of your skill and patience. But at this point, I'd honor your Grandmothers wishes. Have you already found removing them to be easy? I see 1794 and 1804 slots filled in the display. Are these the same coins or different ones than the ones you posted in 2x2s at the start of the thread?
He said he put the 94 and the 04 back in the holder. The 1799 is possibly a contemporary electrotype.
I'd obey your grandma's wishes, I mean she didn't have to give it to you. But if you had too then be very patient and careful (any damage you do can't be undone)
