Advice on a seated liberty dollar

Hey guys, I was wanting some advice on a seated liberty dollar. I was in a 'coin' shop today and picked up some halves that were obviously mispriced, or priced ages ago, but when I inquired I was told the price marked was the price to be paid so I happily bought the 3 64 Kennedy's for $4 each and the 2 49 Frankie's for $8 each. Everything else was outrageously overpriced but I wasn't about to let these slip away.

So after wrapping up the purchase on those 5 coins I noticed an 1859 seated liberty dollar and judging by a quick look on photo grade it is definitely somewhere in the VF neighborhood and wasnt obviously cleaned to my eyes. The price tag is at $300, so my question is should I jump on it?

I kinda already know the answer, but I'm not that familiar with the series.

Here's a picture from photograde that it most resembles. The wear is almost spot on for how LIBERTY looked on the coin I'm looking at.

 

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Doesn't sound like a bad deal to me. I usually like being at $200.00 on Seated Liberty Dollars in VF Details or so with problems (cleaning, damage). $300.00 is under Greysheet Bid, so that's always a good sign. Might be a good deal for you, especially if you need one!

 

Definitely need one and it looks to be a nice coin. All the ones on eBay for less than $300 were like G-4s or F details, and numismedia has the value around $540 or so. The other saving grace is this place doubles as a pawn shop so I may try and locate some junk to take in to sell.

I'm also only planning on offering $250 for it since they've lost so much interest in coins at this shop.

Wish I could think of some junk to pawn.

 

I think for them, if they've been sitting on this item for a while and they are a pawn shop, they would rather have cash. Money talks and they'd probably accept a reasonable offer to do something else with the money. They probably have a fraction of the true value invested in the coin and would like to sell it to you, especially if you go there often.

 

That doesn't mean I can't go sell them my junk a couple of times to establish a 'relationship', save the money and then come up with the rest when I'm done selling to make the purchase. I'm trying to be smart and use as little actual cash as possible. If I can rustle up a few items to sell that makes it an easier decision and more room to realize a potential profit.

Either way I think I'm gonna get this coin, it was really nice and the more I think about it, the more I feel the price was fair at the least.

 

Sounds like a good decision buying it. What type of junk are you talking about? Pawn shops aren't the best for paying for things of course. It just depends on what you're trying to sell to them, but regardless by the way you are speaking, the coin should be very nice!

 

By junk I mean like old DVDs, power tools, tools in general. Old electronics, gaming systems, things like that. Pretty much accumulated junk that is taking up space. This coin is nice enough in my opinion to warrant a send off to NGC for slabbing.

Still trying to think of junk I can sell to get the funds needed. I'm committed to some other coins right now and I'm just trying to be cheap but still acquire this seated dollar.

.......and I'm supposed to be on a 'break' from making larger coin purchases.

So far this week I've picked up a nice commemorative half, working on another seated coin, about to purchase 2 ASE sets, and now this dang dollar had to pop up on me. But how can you turn away when the coin gods are being awfully generous at the moment? You just can't I guess!

 

Haha I agree with you! I think selling that type of "junk" is a good idea if you don't need it and would rather do other things with the money. I hope you get the coin and you enjoy it. Please post a pic for everyone to see too.

 

I will post it as soon as its acquired. I typically post my new stuff in the new acquisition thread so keep an eye out.

 

Are confident that it'd authentic? If you buy it and its fake will they refund you or will it be a $300 lesson? These along with trade dollars probably have more fakes than survivors.

 

I will definitely be taking a chance on this one but I do believe it to be the real deal. The reason the price is at $300 is for the following, all strictly in my humble opinion and from what I can piece together.

This is a pawn shop that also has a decent case of coins. Now as we all know over the last 5-10 years people have been mesmerized with only a few key areas of coins. If they collected they are likely involved in ASEs, or State quarters but must folks were scrapping coin collections or old gold jewelry for money or stacking something. So over the years this man has his coin deals going, but obviously waning from the numismatic side more to the 'bullion/junk/scrap' side of the hobby. So in my mind it seems like the last few years the owner has focused more on that audience and neglected his real coin side. These days he typically has 'associates' selling for him and even they said the coins don't move very much. Most people are just selling junk to them and no one is really buying much except guns and electronics.

Well when I was there the other day I noticed a few halves that were kind of obviously marked several years back as the 64 Kennedy's were priced at $4 each and the 2 franklins at $8 each. I asked if those were all the correct prices and was given affirmation that all the prices marked were what everything in the store was selling for. I said ok and made my purchase.

That's when I noticed the dollar, and I'm thinking it was in a similar 2x2 as the halves that it was probably priced around the same time (obviously yellowed) so I'm assuming the $300 marked was when this coin was only worth $250-$350.
I'm ok buying the coin morally, as the owner really just seems to be uninterested in his store anymore and just trying to get things moving out as quick as possible. He's elderly too, and I think he's just tired of it all IMO, so I think it's an opportunity for a decent deal. I'm also aware I could get burned too, but I seriously doubt it's a fake coin, more likely a cleaned one, but we shall see.

Now my next question is, what are key indicators for authenticating this year or series? Any tell-tale signs?

 

Local antique shop had a 1859-O Seated dollar, obv was a fine/vf, rev was AU, had it listed for like $300+, took pics, came here asking questions. It was a fake. Went back a few months later, got it for like $20(education piece). Im hoping it keeps me clear of counterfeits in the future. Hope you do better. Lots of fakes on these early coins.

 

Duly noted.

That's also why I'm trying to find 'junk' to sell them to hedge my losses a little bit just in case. If I can scrounge $200-$300 in DVDs and play stations and old Tvs and drills, well in definitely gonna try and take advantage of that opportunity.

 

if you have to sell DVDs,drills,old TVs, I would pass on it. pace yourself. coins will be around for a long time.

 

I don't HAVE to sell drills to get, I would LIKE to sell junk to hedge against a possible problem.

Plus I'm also holding out money for the 2-coin ASE sets coming out in a week so just brain storming. Financially I'm alright though, just thought it would be a nice way to take a chance on a possible problem coin.

 

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I see what you are saying Doug, and that's very true in some respects.

So how do you transition from thinking that you know everything and are sure of coins values and authenticity (or really anything in general) and being absolutely POSITIVE about what you are buying and truly knowing about the subject of interest?

You can say read books, look at coins in shows, converse with the experts, attend coin clubs etc. But even with all those prerequisites out of the way you still have to know when and where to put your money up, and when to make purchases. The only way I see truly accomplishing that is by 'gambling' and building confidence in what you are doing and looking at and buying. If I don't buy some tough coins now, when I am 'ready' to buy a real deal coin and second guess myself because I don't have that confidence to pull the trigger on the spot, well that's when a person like you would come in behind me and scoop it out from under me before I had time to come back for a second or third time for authenticating and 'being sure' before pulling the trigger. You would already know, have been in situations similar before, and spring on a $300 coin valued around $500-$1000.

I'm honestly not much of a traditional gambler though. I don't play cards, lottery tickets, casinos, bet on games or anything really, but when I do gamble on something a little larger I try and analyze it to the best of my ability and then take the step if I feel I have the edge.

I'm feeling the edge with this coin and nothing screamed fake to me when I looked at it. I'm aware it's a gamble, I know that, I also feel the upper hand in this one too, so when else are you supposed to gamble?

If I lose, it's a $300 lesson (hopefully less with some sales) that will gauge my eyes and confidence. $300 is a small price to pay to see if I was right and boost my confidence to that next level.

I also realize its a much larger loss if it turns out to be a counterfeit or fake, i will feel the pains more than if i was right. My wallet will be hurt as well as my ego and confidence.

But you know what they say: 'practice makes perfect' and I consider this practice in the art of purchasing good coins.

Ill let you know how it turns out.

 

Well here's the update for all you guys and either I'm stupid as all get out and missed a major mint error or that coin was super fake.

I couldn't weigh it, or take it out of the 2x2 so I was looking for other tell tale signs and on the reverse there was a banner flying proud over the eagle. This is supposed to be during the time of no mottoes and they actually took the red book out for value and that's how I showed them it was a fake before high tailing it out of there.

Good advice once again Doug, which is why it pays to listen to you. Obviously I didn't take your advice, but I still learned some things today and got to keep my money on top of it.

LESSON LEARNED! Buy plastic not the coin!

.............oh great, they're faking those now too!