1889-CC morgan Smart purchase or REALLY BAD one.

I guess you didn't read the part where 189 reeds would be correct for an 1889 P. As someone who handles hundreds of dollars a week my first thought was a genuine struck Morgan. However it's pretty clear that this piece has been identified as a known VAM for 1889 P. That's good enough for me that the entire coin is not fake... But just the mintmark and most likely not of Chinese origin at all.

 

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Case closed in my eyes. Great work you VAM guys.

OP, i would love to hear if you submit it what they said about it.

 

So if a Chinese fake had 189 reeds, that would be coincidence?

 

Not likely... But it would just be a coincidence. The edge looks good from the pictures provided. The Chinese can never get the "look" of the edge right. In my mind there is no doubt that the host coin is genuine.

 

The case they are making is a recognized 1889 P die variety, correct reed count, and an experienced dealer's opinion. Those are enough for me.

 

Sorry to hear the status of the coin was not authentic. I would see if there is any way you can get your money back. Maybe contacting your bank if it was a check, and possible stopping it?

 

1889 CC grades XF45 by SEGS? Buy or pass?

 

Buy only if:

A. The place your buying from can be trusted. Like a big dealer.
B. The person/place your buying it from has a return policy.
C. The asking price is lower than the PCGS price.

If you can do all 3, then do it. Then send it into PCGS. SEGS is not the best TPG, as far as grading, but I've never heard of them slabbing a fake coin.

Now if the slab is SGS, run, don't walk. They are a basement slabber.

 

Price?

SEGS is reputable enough to where I'd feel comfortable purchasing an '89-CC in their slab.

 

I would believe the slab in that instance adds value, as I would be comfortable the coin is genuine.

So, I would value it as a genuine coin, and ignore the grade on the slab. Grade it yourself and decide what your value would be.

 

Could be either. I was one of the first to say that the mint mark looked fake and crude. I still say given the lack of any kind of natural luster, even for a circulated coin (counterfeits have that dull gray deadness to them), I lean towards fake. The "CC" either way isn't real--either it is a 1889 that was repunched (less likely), or a fake 89CC. So, at least the OP probably knows he doesn't have an "instant rarity." Also, the detailing of the stars and letters are rather crude as I did say previously, but got jumped on by nay sayers. The Chinese do excellent work on their "high-line" fakes. Either way, the coin is not worth slabbing, as the expense would exceed the value.

 

A Personal Salute!!

Rob, as one who has endured similar processes in the past searching for Forensic criteria to establish authenticity of a possibly valuable item, I SALUTE YOU!!

You personally took all of the steps reasonably possible for a self determination of value. You ignored the gruel you were fed, obviously by some individuals who hardly knew design parameters of the coin, much less simple steps for counterfeit determination of 90% Silver copies. You apparently used multiple possible experienced resources, searching for a credible objective kernel of substance amongst the chaff.

I personally have great respect for like-kind who ignore the taunts of others in a personal truth establishment odyssey, subjectively knowing the probable outcome, still searching for objectivity, accepting/admitting vulnerability.

I respectfully commend you for your efforts. :thumb:

 

I do as well Rob. I appreciate that you went through the effort, and gave us a reed count which helped clear up the most likely cause. Most posters who come here on CT never do that, and I for one appreciate it.

I hope you stay around and participate more. There is always things to learn for all of us.

Chris

 

$900

 

You think Oz paid $900 for the subject coin?

 

No, the SEGS coin I asked about last page. That was the price.

 

I know it's bad manners to persist, but after 11 pages, I'm itchin to know what Oz paid.

 

If YOU were in the situation the OP is in, given the repeated pleas for forum assistance and several other suggestions to 'send it in'...what would YOU do? Seems to me that an investment of the size we must be talking about here is well worth the $30 or so to get an expert, hands-on opinion. If it's a fake, so be it, and the lesson (we've ALL paid for these lessons) cost $30 more to learn with certitude. What OTHER course of action would you suggest?

 

He posted at CCF $1800

I hope he gets his money back

 

You're right, W, and that advice came from a guy supposedly set on submitting coins barely worth the plastic. As another member recently said, its "do as I say and not as I do" when it comes to Tim's wisdom.



$1800... Ouch. Hopefully at least some precautions were taken. I wish you the best, sir.