Anyone good at grading AU Indian Heads

Anyone good at grading AU Indian Heads? Are these in fact AU as their flips state and if so, what grade of AU? I see there are several listed at Numismedia.com.

 

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They do appear to be AU. Which au? It's really hard to tell from the photos. I can't see the detail close enough to determine that.

 

Well, the first coin has nice AU details, maybe AU55, but with all that gunk on it, it would never make it in a problem free holder.

The second coin barely makes it into AU, but it has some Verdigris on it, plus a significant hit on the cheek. This coin would also not grade.

 

The 1904 is heavily corroded.

 

I think you guys need an eye exam, because they are neither gunky or corroded, looks au58 and au 53 to me

 

Yes, I think for the first one, I think they are confusing gunk with the color of the coin. I probably should do a picture of this instead of scan to show it's true look. The other one looks like it normally does since it is a much lighter color. I know what a corroded coin looks like and examined many and yes, it isn't corrosion you are seeing rather it's dark color. I will try to do a regular picture, I have to take out my camera or set up my web cam later. The tiny amount of verdigris on the second one I certainly wouldn't give any concern to. Which one is AU58, the first one? Since the first one is toned and toning is corrosion, I guess you could say it is corroded like any other toned coin. I am also wondering about this one marked XF. Their are more diamonds than XF coins:

 

Need larger pics Buddy.......





I'm thinkin' XF.......

 

I realize some do not agree with me, but that 1904 is corroded as all get out (environmental damage). If you could provide better photos you could either convince me I am wrong or I could educate you as to why I am right.

 

Actually coins with luster and diamonds are AU. I know I was trying to determine if this one shiny IHC was above XF but it didn't have all the diamonds so XF. I wonder about others like above I have that have diamonds and luster but marked XF? I believe though that sometimes a scanner doesn't capture luster.

 

Scanners are horribly difficult on luster. I know a few folks who have been successful in showing luster on coins with a printer but I could never do it. Get a cheap digital camera with macro capabilities and you'll see a world of difference.

 

I agree, I found when scanning silver dimes with luster I couldn't see the luster, only reflected light. I do have a cheap camera and have a better one available along with a rather nice web cam. I am going to do some experimenting. For lower graded coins, they have no luster anyhow so I would just scan them since it is easier.

 

Doug is it possible to stop the toning process ?

Dave

 

I see it the same.

 

My intentions were not to prove you wrong nor you having to prove you right. I never asked whether anyone thought it was corroded and don't want to spark that debate. I asked what level AU it was since it was marked AU and see there are several listed unlike other grades like Fine or extra fine. I am not going to post another picture for this purpose, for someone to prove their point. I know that I read on the NGC website that if the corrosion effects the overall appearance of the coin, the details grade is assigned. The coin is dark I realize but it certainly doesn't have the appearance of coins I have seen with heavy corrosion nor their certainly isn't gunk on it so I would disagree with those statements. It is my opinion though that people generally are more concerned about the overall appearance of the coin and believe that the light brown coin and the other 1907 I posted later have a nicer appearance.

My opinion is that of what the forum administer was speaking of, the naturally toning process that eventually will turn the coin black rather than some type of environmental damage. I certainly think that it is perfectly acceptable to believe what you want. I have gotten grades on coins that range from VG08 through VF25 when asked and certainly don't believe them all. I do realize though that when dealing with opposing points of view, ego and reputation do come into play but people can't be right all the time. This coin below is certainly higher than a VG08:
http://www.cointalk.com/attachments/215035d1352448722t-cent-1834-1a.jpg

 

I'm not worried about ego or reputation; I spend my time on these boards to educate others while realizing at the same time that I can also learn. There seems to be some difference of opinion as to the surface of this coin and it helps no one to ignore the discussion instead of simply posting a better image. Folks learn through discussion and teaching. The toning process rarely leads to a corroded coin, but environmental damage will lead to a corroded coin.

 

The 1904 IMHO is at best grade Fine. The 1907 IMHO is at best an EF grade. Besides corrosion and verdigris I see enough wear on both
to cancel out an AU grade.

 

I would disagree with that one from what I read about grading IHCs. The fine grade has a lower curl that isn't separate from the tassel and has the liberty but it is not bold. There are no diamonds present. Below is a fine coin, I think may be corroded. As far as the small amounts of verdigris in the second coin, it is too slight to warrant doing something about it like using Verdicare. I also don't understand how a hit on the cheek would keep it from slabbing, I see coins with hits slab all the time. I know that grading can be really subjective, some seem to over-grade, some under. There some coins in the lot I receive marked XF I would consider bordering AU because of the luster and full diamonds. I do realize AU are still circulated coins still subject to other things circulated coins are subject to. They clang together in circulation. All circulated coins are potential "problem coins" because they have went through a abuse for centuries and you can't expect to pick at them as they were expected to be perfect. In that case, just buy slabbed MS coins or mint sold coins. I just posted this since I see that there are many AU grades and don't really know the difference. Perhaps I will just read about the differences. Maybe better just to say AU like Fine or very good.

 

So would you call this coin corroded ?

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