grade of this large cent?

What would you consider the grade of this large cent? Fine or very fine? I know it is listed as a 1884 Liberty Head cent, I think that is why I got it cheap. Also, does anyone know the type of 1834 cent?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/MIXED-LOT-1884-LIBERTY-HEAD-ONE-CENT-1905-LIBERTY-HEAD-NICKEL-NR-NO-RESERVE-/181002445174?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&nma=true&si=1JTpb2ymqI2oSVkRdBRekBApRlM%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

 

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Its a Liberty Head cent, also known as the Matron Head sub-type Liberty Head cent. I would give it a VF. Nice buy.

 

That I was thinking it may be, VF. I wanted to make sure since I notice a jump in value on the guides from F to VF. It appears to be a "small eight" when I compare it to other guides. I know one variation of that year is rare. If it was listed as 1834 Matron Head Large Cent, it would have sold for more.

 

I dare say triple what you paid if "large cent" had been used in the description.

 

Plus it was placed in the "liberty nickels" section with the wrong year in the title and I as you mentioned, the term "large cent" was never mentioned. The liberty/v nickel is worth a buck, but do need that year I think. Redbook is $65 for the coin, even half that is triple.

 

At least F-15 depending on how many hair lines are visible. you need about 8/10 hairlines for it to grade VF

Either way super good deal!

 

What hairlines are you talking about?

 

I think the poster is talking about the actual hair of the bust figure.

 

I see it as a VG-8, but still a great buy at that price.

 

Low end F at best.

 

I would certainly disagree with VG going by the photograde website and it certainly can't be VG-VF. I would probably agree with lonegun and cowboy, somewhere around the F-15/VF-20 range but need to get it in hand to tell really. Just because I paid what I did, doesn't automatically downgrade it. In the VG-08 grade, there is wear on the top of the liberty, which I just don't see. I know grading is subjective but the range is so broad that some of the grades are simply incorrect and they are based on the cost of the coin. I know I am seeing a bold liberty but as far as fine details, it is most likely difficult to tell by the picture. I did just find this website on grading the matron head cent. http://www.uscents.com/coppergrade/gradesmatron.html. It states in the fine grade the LIBERTY is separate from the coronet. I am guessing the hair cord is the rubber band around the ponytail?

 

I am going by PCGS/NGC standards and what I have seen in thirty plus years of serious collecting. I didn't base it on what you paid, just what I see.

 

I would guess VG-10, maybe F-12. Looking forward to seeing a better picture once you get it in person.

 

It is a small 8, N-2 R-1

 

The picture is to blurry to really get a grade, but I would put it in the Fine range to start with - then net it down for the problems it looks like it has. From the looks of it there is some rim damage and maybe some corrosion. A nice clear picture would be more helpful. Just my opinion.

 

I saw that it was a small eight when comparing it to pictures in the Redbook. I notice one large 8 coin is rare and worth more. What is N-2, R-1?

 

it looks to be in F-12, but the pictures make it hard to be precise

 

I know from reading the website I posted and the Redbook, it is at
least fine since LIBERTY is separate from the coronet and the cords are present. IF you notice though, it is hard to get a close view from the picture since when you zoom in on computer pictures they always become blurry. I have pretty good scanners and typically use them since the pictures are larger automatically. I think it takes some keen eyesight to determine fine details from a picture taking a few feet away rather than a direct scan since the coin is directly on the scanner, kind of like a camera but directly on the coin with a zoom. If you look very closely without zooming there are hairlines present. There is also light reflected on the rims but most like a a rim dent because this is a circulated coin and coins hit each other. I don't see any heavy corrosion. I think though I will grade this for myself though but thanks for your opinions but opinions are become too varied that it is becoming noise. I would say it is at least Fine maybe VF because as cowboy stated which is correct, the VF grade is determined by hairlines but also hair cords which are hard to see in this picture because it isn't close enough.

 

N-2 R-1 refers to the die variety and the rarity of that variety. There are 7 die varieties in 1834 and they are referenced by Newcomb numbers or N numbers. N-1 and 2 are both small 8 and common. N-3 - 7 are all large 8. N-5 is rare and expensive, especially in better grade and/or problem free. N-7 is a proof only variety and there are only 8 specimens known. The last one found was a circulated piece that only graded VG-8.

Rarity, the R number, is the rarity based on the Sheldon Rarity scale. The scale runs from R-8 (Extremely Rare) with 1 to 3 pieces known to exist down to R-1- which is Very Common with over 1500 pieces estimated to exist. The 34 N-5 is an R-5+ coin with 31 to 45 coins known. The 34 N-7 is an R-7 or 7 - 9 pieces known. The scale runs

R-8 1 - 3 Known Unique or nearly so
R-7 4 - 12 Known Extremely rare
R-6 13 - 30 Known Very Rare
R-5 31 - 75 Known Rare
R-4 76 - 200 Estimated Scarce (Notice the change from Known to Estimated)
R-3 201 - 600 Estimated Not so Common
R-2 601 - 1200 Estimated Common
R-1 1201 - over 1500 Estimated Very Common
A + or - are used to indicate if the population is in the upper (rarer) or lower (more common) third of the range. The 34 N-5 is in the upper third of the R-5 range or R-5+

The exact numbers in the ranges of R-2 and R-1 are a bit questionable and I have seen different authors use different numbers. The higher end of R-2 at 601 is solid though.

 

Here it is. I am kind of ticked off since the seller just taped this to a piece of manilla. I don't think I will leave bad feedback but will advise them since I don't think they know better.