Do Bills With Doubled Serials Exist? What about a $5 Note Printed Over A $1 Note? Pic

I have to start by saying I bought what was supposed to be a 1909S VDB from a guy on ebid. It cost me $600, and when I got it I noticed immediately the mint mark was fake, which was verified by multiple dealers. So I asked for a refund and returned it. I got the refund, but now the guy is continuing to try and scam me by saying I sent back a different coin, and that he's going to file mail fraud charges against me. So just in case, I'm trying to build my case, because he is selling blatantly faked coins, and I have a hunch his error notes are fake too, but wanted to post them here to confirm. I also find it very odd that in every one of his auctions, he asks the buyer to keep it for their collection and not attempt to resell it. I also found the same guy on another site asking how to dissolve silver and copper with nitric acid for etching coins. I did nothing wrong, this guy did, so I'm not worried, but when someone says they're going to file a mail fraud case against you, it makes you rip your hair out, especially when you're the one being conned. He is also selling 1916D Mercs with vertical mint marks, which I have never seen a case of even existing. They've been about a 45 degree angle in every example I've seen. Is this guy a fraud? Who do I report him to?

 

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It is not possible for either one of these notes to be errors produced by the BEP. They were likely produced with a color printer.

 

Those are not errors, those are homemade bills. Do you realize what the chances are that that many errors occurred for that bill to be printed like that? Nearly impossible.

And the problem with key coins especially a 1909-S VDB is that its heavily counterfeited. You should not be buying key or even semi-key coins raw. Unless its from a trusted dealer that you know.

 

So who should I report this guy to?

 

There is a report item on each auction item, I believe at the right side of the page. I have had a couple of his phony errors removed but it's always a struggle since eBay doesn't care that much as long as they get their vig. I reported one just 10 minutes before I read this thread. I encourge people to do the same.

 

Here's a link to the "eBid" auction page for the '16-D merc. I have no idea about the authenticity of this coin:

http://us.ebid.net/for-sale/d-mercury-dime-key-date-70172845.htm

And here's the notes in question:

http://us.ebid.net/for-sale/one-dollar-note-double-printing-70776830.htm

http://us.ebid.net/for-sale/one-dollar-error-notes-70172756.htm

 

The possibility of either of those notes being genuine BEP errors is absolutely zero.

 

The 16-D Mercury ia a blatant forgery - %100 positive diagnosis!

 

I would think if he's doing this on a color printer he's counterfeiting US currency and maybe the Feds would like to hear about it.
Bill Colector

 

He's not counterfeiting, as those are real notes. He is over printing them, effectively mutilating them.

 

This is something he has attempted to cover his bases on too, making sure to describe every coin and note he lists as 100% legal tender U.S. currency. My question is, if I contacted the authorities over this, is it something they would actually pursue the way they would if he was printing the notes, or do they consider it too petty to bother with it? I'd love nothing more than to stick it to this guy, because the whole experience just has me heated.

 

He's not doing anything illegal with the notes themselves. They are real currency, so he is not counterfeiting. The Secret Service will not really pay any attention to this guy, but it might be worth reporting him to eBay - especially if he is trying to scam you on the return.

I noticed the doubled serial number and figured it must be fake. There are genuine doubled 3rd printings and they are worth quite a bit. A doubled 3rd printing will have doubled serial numbers. However, the word "ONE" under the treasury seal is actually part of the 2nd printing. In order for that part to be doubled, the entire face of the note would have to be doubled as well.

For the $5 on $1 printing error - you'll know that it is fake, because of how notes are printed. The genuine error is called an offset error and happens when a sheet of paper does not make it all the way into the press and causes the next few notes to become offset error notes. The sheet normally enters between an impression cylinder and a printing plate. If the paper doesn't enter all the way, the cylinder and plate make contact and the ink transfers from the printing plate to the impression cylinder on the opposite side. When the next sheet comes in, it gets the intended printing from the printing plate, and another of the same design on the other side from the impression cylinder.

This means the same design must be appear on both sides. The only way I can imagine for this error to occur is on a double denomination error.

 

So with the coins, adding a mint mark to a coin to make the value go from a few dollars to hundreds of dollars, then selling them online isn't illegal?

 

Unethical. Slime ball tactics. Scum of the earth.

If it's just adding a mintmark or altering the coin, it's not illegal. It's taking advantage of bidder's lack of knowledge.

 

Unethical? Yes. Illegal? I'm not sure.

 

Altering the coin is not illegal (we've been through this a number of times here on CT). However, altering the coin to appear to be a valuable numismatic item, and selling the item as such, is fraud. And yes, it's illegal.

 

So who does he get turned in to and who has to make the charges against him as a Fraud and a Com Man.
Bill Collector

 

Coins or notes, the term "counterfeit" is used far too often in cases where "alteration" should have been.

 

The OP will have to pursue that. The seller has been shut down by eBid... all his auctions are gone.

 

I did find 2 avenues I reported him to that seem very interested in pursuing things. Since he sold the items knowing they were not genuine on the internet, IC3 is very interested in looking further into it, since he is using the internet to pursue his fraudulent endeavors. Also, since he used the postal service to mail me a $600 coin that was just a regular coin (which is very hard to verify just through pictures, which I will only do in person from here on out), he effectively committed mail fraud I believe. So I reported the case, along with all of the information I had backing my claims to the appropriate people. If anything, the idiot won't just be able to play dumb and pretend like he didn't know the coins were fake, because I tracked down a post of his from 2009 on another site that in so many words was asking how to alter mint marks on silver coins. Almost like he was asking for tips on how to use nitric acid to alter a coin to make it more valuable. Then a guy pointed out how easy it was to do on copper. This is all information he would not have been interested in if he didn't know exactly what he was attempting to do. He also mentioned his dad had showed him tricks when he was a kid, so I dug deeper and found some information on his father. What a stand up guy this character was. He served a total off 22 years in prison between his 3 sentences for possession of counterfeit money. Then recently died in prison while serving time for child molestation. I guess the apple didn't fall far from the tree.