PVC use in coin supplies???

Discussion in 'Coin Chat' started by mkwelbornjr, Aug 18, 2012.

Page 1 of 4
  1. mkwelbornjr

    mkwelbornjr Junior Member

    The dangers of PVC to coins as widely known. Why then do reputable suppliers still make storage and display holder out of PVC vinyl? Is it possible to have inert soft PVC vinyl?

    Even mints seal coins in PVC..China Mint...silver bars...etc.. This prevents someone from ever having a mint sealed coin.
     
    mkwelbornjr, Aug 18, 2012
    #1 + Quote Reply
  2. Avatar

    Guest User Guest



    to hide this ad.
  3. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    There's a couple of reasons. First and foremost is cost, soft flips are cheaper to make and thus cheaper to buy. Secondly, but perhaps even more importantly, on a short term basis the soft PVC flips do not damage the coins like the stiffer, archival flips do.
     
    GDJMSP, Aug 18, 2012
    #2 + Quote Reply
  4. mkwelbornjr

    mkwelbornjr Junior Member

    SO the PVC-free flips damage coins? When I ship raw coins...I place in a poly bag...then place that in the PVC free flip..keeps the coin stable. Is that a good method?
     
    mkwelbornjr, Aug 19, 2012
    #3 + Quote Reply
  5. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Yeah, they do. Because the plastic is not soft it has hard, sharp edges. So when you put the coin into or take it out of the flips those edges will hairline or even scratch the coin. It's a lot like slide marks in albums.

    And, because the plastic is not soft, and because the coin moves around inside the flip, the coin will get flip rub (light wear) from sliding around inside the flip.

    Yeah I suppose. But I wouldn't do it. Why use the flip at all if you are using the bag ?
     
    GDJMSP, Aug 19, 2012
    #4 + Quote Reply
  6. Aslpride

    Aslpride Active Member

    Seriously? How can I ensure the coins are safe stored and ship to TPGs without harm the coins? I wonder if it is reason why many of us send nice coins, but returned with lower grade? Did TPGs' recommend to use 2.5x2.5 pvc free flips is bad recommenation?
     
    Aslpride, Aug 19, 2012
    #5 + Quote Reply
  7. mrbrklyn

    mrbrklyn New Member

    I recently pick up a coin from somewhere that had on the labeling of the coin a warning that the flip is not recommended for long term storage. I was quite amazed and thought the dealer was very professional.
     
    mrbrklyn, Aug 20, 2012
    #6 + Quote Reply
  8. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    Years ago some of the auction houses had the same warning on their holders.
    I put one away and forgot about it. PVC really messed up the coin.
     
    ldhair, Aug 20, 2012
    #7 + Quote Reply
  9. areich

    areich America*s Darling

    You can not use PVC in any conservation at all.
     
    areich, Aug 20, 2012
    #8 + Quote Reply
  10. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    If you follow their submission rules, you can't.

    Highly doubtful, in the time it takes for the coin to leave you, get to the TPG, and get graded, not much is going to happen. Could the coin get 1 or 2 additional hairlines or a light scratch ? Yes of course it could, but that does not mean that it will.

    They are kind of covering their backsides when they do this. The TPGs are well aware of the risks in using mylar flips. But they are also well aware of the risks in using soft PVC flips. And, they are also aware of the time frames involved in getting coins graded. When the TPGs get really busy a coin may sit in that flip for up to 2 or even 3 months. So they consider the risk of the coin being in a PVC flip for that amount of time to be a greater risk than that of using a mylar flip.

    So, they recommend you use mylar flips for shipping them the coins.

    What you have to understand is this, it is not the shipping of the coins to the TPG that you should be worried about because that it is only for a short period of time. What collectors need to worry about is the long term storage of their coins.

    If you use mylar flips to store coins, over time that coin may be taken in and out of the flip many, many times. And it will also be sliding around inside that flip many, many, times. It is the repetition that creates the greater risk. For with repetition the coin may acquire a lot of hairlines, a lot of flip rub. And that will definitely have a negative impact on the grade or condition of your coin.

    There is one and only one type of coin holder that poses no risk to your coins - the hard plastic coin holders. But there are many different brands of hard plastic coin holders - any of them can be used, and safely.

    ALL other types of coin holders, PVC flips, mylar flips, cardboard 2x2s, albums, folders, envelopes, rolls, coin tubes, etc etc etc - all of them pose risks of various kinds to your coins. And no, that is not an opinion, that is a fact.
     
    GDJMSP, Aug 20, 2012
    #9 + Quote Reply
  11. rickmp

    rickmp Frequently flatulent.

    I don't know about PCGS, but NGC will accept coins in Air-Tites.
     
    rickmp, Aug 20, 2012
    #10 + Quote Reply
  12. Aslpride

    Aslpride Active Member

    Doug: Thank you for explain details on long term storage. I use them for temporary storage to be ready for ship to TGP soon. I don't remove coin from flip when I insert coin. I hope it will not get hairline from shipping.

    rickmp: Here's quote from PCGS' recommendation for ship...

    "House your coins individually in 2 ½" x 2 ½" mylar flips (we do not accept acrylic snap cases or cardboard and stapled coin holders). Place the coin in the inside front pouch of the flip so the openings of the flip are not exposed."

    Oh well.
     
    Aslpride, Aug 20, 2012
    #11 + Quote Reply
  13. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Yeah, they both will. But they will charge you a dollar more for each one, and you are out the Air-Tite. That used to be the charge anyway, it may have gone up by now.

    Not that that is really that big of a deal on most coins.
     
    GDJMSP, Aug 20, 2012
    #12 + Quote Reply
  14. areich

    areich America*s Darling

    That is incorrect and archival materials should be used only. Plastic is terrible and not inert... all of it.

    Only products made of materials specifically designed for long term storage and archival use should be used. Most likely it should not be air tight either.

    Amanda
     
    areich, Aug 21, 2012
    #13 + Quote Reply
  15. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    What do you fell is better for coin storage?
     
    ldhair, Aug 21, 2012
    #14 + Quote Reply
  16. areich

    areich America*s Darling

    That depends on the item and if it displayed or not, how often it is disturbed, how it is handled and more. Temperature and moisture control are the first considerations. Storage and archival techniques is a complex and learned skill.

    Minimally, expensive and rare items should be in a temperature and moisture controlled storage cabinet, separated by Polyester, archival quality film sheets with air exchange. If displayed, then one can use UV filtered, advanced light sensitive glass. The key to safety is not plastic, but temperature, moisture, light and contact control. This is the cornerstone of all archival storage techniques.

    Amanda
     
    areich, Aug 22, 2012
    #15 + Quote Reply
  17. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Amanda, all of the hard plastic coin holders are archival.
     
    GDJMSP, Aug 22, 2012
    #16 + Quote Reply
  18. BadThad

    BadThad Calibrated for Lincolns

    PVC type polymers are only a problem over the long term. They pose no risk until the plasticizer degrades and releases hydrochloric acid. Depending on the ambient conditions, this normally takes years.
     
    BadThad, Aug 22, 2012
    #17 + Quote Reply
  19. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    We are talking coins not art.
     
    ldhair, Aug 22, 2012
    #18 + Quote Reply
  20. areich

    areich America*s Darling

    The principles remain the same. Do you think I've never worked with precious metals or coins?

    Amanda
     
    areich, Aug 23, 2012
    #19 + Quote Reply
  21. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    Not at all Amanda. I know you do some really cool stuff in this field.
    Knowing that, I wondered what type of holder you felt best for the average collector.
     
    ldhair, Aug 23, 2012
    #20 + Quote Reply
46 more messages...
Page 1 of 4
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page