Attribution of PL and DMPL on raw coins

I was just wondering how do sellers and buyers know when to attribute the term PL and DMPL on raw coins. I know there are certain rules when determining the reflectivity of a coin. But when looking at one whether from a seller's showcase or from a online photo, how do you really know?

Even PCGS and NGC have different standards, I think. How can a person say a coin is DMPL when its raw? And was also wondering, of you saw a seller put DMPL or PL on a holder would you trust them? They could be saying it just because the coin is really clean.

 

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I don't accept that designation unless it has been conveyed by a TPG, as their standards have gotten very strict. Nowadays, for a DMPL, 8" of reflectivity is expected. It used to be 4 or 6." So, I would NOT accept a raw designation by a seller.

 

In my eyes... If its not in a top tier holder... It's almosy certaintly not DMPL.

 

What do you mean by 8" of reflectivity?

 

I believe the mirrors must be reflective from 8 inches away.

 

If it's a raw coin, I don't take anyone's word for it if I don't know and trust their knowledge. I usually judge for myself, in-hand, not from photos.

To test the reflectivity, place the coin at the end of a ruler, and see the greatest number you can read clearly.

Chris

 

So would it be weird to be doing the ruler thing in a coin store?

 

the ruler thing...hahaha not really, the only thing I have to say is stick to the slabbed, pl and dmpl are very popular but being slightly off can cost you a lot when buying a coin

 

Once you learn the technique, you can use almost any printed material to check and estimate the distance.

Chris

 

Awwwww, c'mon Doug. You must have blown at least one--nobody is perfect. Those are the ones you know about. You might have sold somebody a coin that didn't make grade.

 

Then you're not just a collector or coin enthusiast--you're totally omniscient. That is a record I find hard to defend. I mean, not a single honest mistake or hiccup? Using that logic, you should have been a one-man TPG--who needs PCGS or NGC.

 

The belief that if a coin is not in a TPG holder with a PL or DMPL on the label is not a PL or DMPL coin, even though the coin meets the standards for those attributions, is nonsense at best.

 

No, it isn't nonsense. It is called standardized grading, and we've had this debate a thousand times. Otherwise, every sleazy dealer can call any bright white coin with some mirror effect on it whatever he or she wants. As is, you see all kinds of grading abuse on Ebay. I will leave it to the TPGs to give that attribution and just collect my coins and enjoy them, claiming no skills beyond any other collector to verify such designations.

 

No. It's called reliance on an imperfect service.

The coin has to have the criteria and meet the standards prior to being submitted to any TPG for a PL or DMPL attribution consideration. If it doesn't meet those standards, the TPG will not attribute the PL or DMPL on the label. If the TPG believes the coin meets the standards for those attributions, which it would have the criteria prior to submission, it receives the appropriate label.

Any knowledgeable collector, or dealer, can test the coin to see if it meets those standards, and if it does, they can attribute the coin accordingly.

A TPG's say so is not required. It's all about the knowledge of the collector/dealer.

By your theory, a coin that meets the criteria for a 63 grade, is not a 63 grade because it's not under a TPG label with a 63 on it. The holder doesn't make the grade so, the coin's appearance does.

It's been that way even long before the TPGs.

 

Yes, it has been that way for YEARS before TPGs, and the brilliant uncirculated coins sold by dealers became AU when it came time to sell them. Obviously, an experienced collector or for that matter, even a newbie, can call any coin whatever he or she wants. I can call my MS 63 a 68 if I want to, and vindicate that grade with my authority and experience. However, that doesn't convey any set numerical or statistically valid reference point for arms length value of a coin--it is just opinion--no disrespect intended, but opinion. It may well be good opinion, and based on years of experience. However, it is still far more subjective than a standardized system of grading and attribution. I remember the "bad old days" quite well, and abuses of grading, attribution and designation were chaotic and singularly based on opinion, with one-sided basis in fact--the fact of the person selling the coin saying "it is a gem." Try reselling the same coin, and all of a sudden, it is "not bad, but has a rub here and there." Too subjective for my liking.

 

That's where you're confused.

Grading is subjective, regardless if a TPG grades a coin, or a collector, or dealer. It's still a subjective process, has been, and always will be.

Bad old days? Hardly.

 

I am not at all confused. I believe that TPGs are better equipped to objectively grade and attribute. No confusion at all. We have a divergence of opinion--simple as that, and that is fine.