The toner that separates the men from the boys.

I second these points. Imperfections in oversized photos can almost disappear in hand. I really like the vivid nature of the rainbow toning on the obverse, especially the first progression of magenta and emerald green. However, I am not a fan of the price and would like it better at the $1,500-$1,750 range.

 

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I agree -- I'd like to see 65s that look like that. My reaction to the coin you posted was that it looks more like what the TPGs grade 66 these days.

 

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I think you are being too critical.

Look at other coins in 65, and I think you will see the marks are completely consistent with others in that grade.

If you would like to post your 63's, I (and others) would certainly comment on the grade they received.

Hope this helps...Mike

 

I love toned coins and think this coin is quite pretty, but I would not value it near the $2,500 price offered on ebay. However, the seller is free to negotiate a price in any manner he thinks effective. I will also have to agree to disagree with anyone who thinks the coin is MS63, though I am not writing that I embrace the MS65+ grade, either.

 

Here is another toned MS 65--NOT mine. I think this is a 65, despite the cheek scratch, as is the originally posted coin. Doug, you are being way too harsh--remember that Morgans get lots of hits, and the fields and reverse are spotless on the original coin. This coin isn't mine--it is another one of Shane's, and I agree with the 65 grade. This coin went for about $250, and that seems more right on for a beautiful Morgan common date toner that is a 65.

 

Shane always has a nice selection. I browse his Ebay store once in a while looking for toned buffalo nickels. Not relevent I guess.
Guy

 

Coming from another toner and Morgan collector I have to say that coin is a tiny bit too much. The seller can ask whatever price he wants too but I would not pay that much for a common date toner.

I also feel that collectors who collect toned coins tend to look at the colors first. The grade although important becomes a secondary factor. A coin can be a low MS but when wildly toned carries a huge premium. And I'm not speaking for others, but I personally don't find that toning exceptional. There are tons of Morgans that look better than the one shown. And some randomness in toning can look very nice, much better than a rainbow.

 

Please bear in mind that Shane lists many coins on consignment, and the asking price may be that of a client.

Chris

 

While I agree with the others that the coin is a bit over-graded...the photos don't look right to me. I'm sure it's a gorgeous coin, but I think the photos a juiced.

 

Looks a little AT for me. Maybe Im a boy but I wouldn't spend money on that without getting an opinion from a couple toning people I know.

 

Cam, If you knew Shane, you'd know that he doesn't do that.

Chris

 

What on earth would make you say that? The coin is question is a quintessential bag toned Morgan Dollar. There is only one potential problem with the toning on the coin with regards to originality and I am 99% sure that nobody on this forum could tell me what it is.

 

Looks a little bright and neon for me. I would like to see it in hand before I made my call and show it to people. It looks close to real but I'm cautious when it comes to toners now
It does have the right color sequence(s) but its just so bright. Maybe it's the photos. After listening to how coins are doctored you become a little cautious

Ok good for you but no good for us unless you share it.

 

The vivid nature of the toning is the primary reason that the seller's asking price is so high. The fact is that the color scheme and progression on that Morgan Dollar are exactly what one would expect to see from a bag toned Morgan Dollar. Here is another example with very similar color scheme and vivid colors.



When you make a claim that a coin is AT with absolutely no logical reason to support your claim, all you do is hurt your own credibility.

 

I said it looks little fishy but never declared it was AT. I do not claim to have the greatest amount of toning knowledge which is why I said I would want someone to look at it.
The coin above just seems more believable to me by far for whatever reason.
As for my credibility I did not know voicing an idea and claiming that I would consult an expert before dropping 2k+ or whatever it is would cost me credibility.
Honestly I took a toned coin test at ANA and it was extremely hard for me so it made me a little 'jumpy' when I see a super bright colorful coin.

 

You have me curious; I thought I had gained a good bit of knowledge from your Toning Premium Thread.

All I can see that's "missing'' from this toner are the blast white shadows around (primarily) the stars due to metal flow, but apparently even this doesn't necessarily have to be present for NT, so I'm stumped. (Besides, this is a common characteristic of toners and I'd doubt you'd accuse 99% of CTers of not knowing it.)

Does it have to do with color changes in transitions from field to devices? I don't have time to study the coin any more closely this morning.

 

I've purchased a few coins from Krypt's... I can say with confidence that you'll not see too many pictures "anywhere" more representative of the coin in hand, so believe what you see here is my advice.
That said, given what we see and NT/AT.... ask Doug, he can tell you with absolute knowingness which it is.
As to characteristics of NT/AT... the only thing I could pony up would be the itsy-bitsy halo's' around some of the itsy-bitsy'er debris on the fields by the top of the forehead and hair and around L and U... I've read somewhere that this "may" be a sign of AT... however, there haven't been too many things I've read about AT 'tells' that I haven't see in NT holders at some point in time...and I'm not even certain this 'tell' is really a good 'tell'...... Lehigh and Shane are the dudes to ask imo.. Doug will add flavor to their soup.

 

I agree that Shane's pictures are representative of extremely typical toning patters of Morgans (having collected and observed Morgans for over 30 years). That bright "neon" look on the obverse is not AT--that is typical bag/coin reaction, and is oft observed, especially with "O" mint Morgans, due to extremely humid conditions upon storage. I don't think that there is anything evident in the picture of the coin that I posted as OP that would indicate anything but normal, natural toning, but rather spectacular in nature. Do people perhaps "over pay" for that type of toning? Yes sometimes. The ones I got from Shane/Kryptonite went for a very fair price in auction, with a modest premium for toning, and that is how it normally goes. DO some folks let reason go out the window with toning? Sure, but then again, I know folks who have paid over $100,000 for a car, that is no better functioning than a Honda or Toyota. They are paying for exclusivity, and same goes to the ultra high premiums for extreme toning--it is an exclusivity thing, and many like that. Matter of taste--some would rather have a circulated 89cc for that kind of money, and that is their choice to do so.

 

Well put. I have no problem if someone is sophisticated enough to know why he likes this piece to pay whatever he feels like, just like buying an Aston Martin or a gull wing mercedes. There is room enough for all under the coin collecting umbrella.

However, for newer collectors who ONLY see color and therefor attribute bright colors with high worth, and don't know the difference between this and AT clown coins, that is the danger. Paul buying a coin like this wouldn't trouble me, a newbie buying a coin he believes is similar because its brightly colored does, since the newbie will be wasting a whole big pot of money.

Would I personally buy this? That is not the issue really, (I wouldn't be buying a gull wing or an Aston Martin either FWIW). The issue to me is everyone reading this NEEDING to know why this coin is a desirable piece, and why it is different than so many doctored pieces out there. If they don't know that they are in trouble.