"CAC" sticker? Is this necessary, or should I pursue one?

I think the word "sucker" got some blood pressures elevated. I know it elevated the heck out of mine. Maybe it should have been removed from the start..........

 

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I am not the one who brought business into this, you are, my friend. Maybe you are the one who needs to climb down and stop assuming that just because you may know business, you automatically know the coin business too.

Simply trying to show you another side and one that could help you. We could tear this down into different TPG standards to try and show that all grades are not equal, but I fear there would be no point in doing so. Also you should note that there is a difference between using the raw only mentality you've displayed as an example and pointing the finger at you. While it is admirable that someone can open themselves to a different point of view, continuing to push something you admittedly know little about (including telling someone much more familiar than yourself that they are a "sucker") has helped to dig this hole.

 

Thanks, but I'm not sure why you're quoting this. I went back and reread your post and noticed you're using your alphabet backwards, at least as far as CAC goes. Like school grades, "A" represents the highest quality, then "B" then "C". CAC will sticker a coin that is solid for its grade, i.e., "A" or "B" quality. Perhaps that's the source of the confusion.

 

Actually it's a pretty friendly crowd but, for some reason, many people seem to object to being called suckers and being talked down to. Go figure!
My advice to you would be to let this thread go and let things blow over.

 

Yes you did, but not everybody will read all the way through a thread before posting. Either that or they missed it in the middle of a post. And yes it is a tough crowd around here at times - even when something is just an opinion.

 

A recent trend mentioned in the Greysheets Newsletter states that CAC coins are selling with strength while those without are sitting on the shelf. I buy and sell frequently and will submit to CAC any coin I feel is an exceptional coin. The key word is exceptional and a plus grade is no guarantee your coin will earn the sticker. I have had more than one plus grade returned without that coveted sticker and I can tell you from experience that the coin submitted better be exceptional as most submissions are rejected. This does not mean the coin is overgraded, it simply means the coin isn't in the top two thirds of the grade.

I'm a bit surprised no one has mentioned the purpose of CAC and why it is so highly respected. In essence, CAC seperates the low end coins from the exceptional coins in the same grade. I don't always agree with some of the stickered coins I see ... but far more often than not, I do agree.
What I agree with or don't agree with really isn't relevant. The market agrees with and has strongly accepted CAC ... and this market will indeed pay a premium for those coins carrying the CAC sticker. If anything, CAC is too strict in awarding their sticker 99% of the time ... and that's why those coins get the premium.

Considering the value of your coin ... I say go for it!

 

Did you just skim over the comments? I mentioned this twice within the last page and provided a link to CAC's explanation. I think it's been mentioned, or at least alluded to, before my comments as well.

 

Yes, guilty as charged. I hadn't realized there were 5 pages of thread here. My appologies as well as my respect for pointing out this important information.

 

I didn't see anything wrong with the general statements I was making, but when people started making specific insults, I took offense and got defensive. In hindsight, I can see how some people might have been offended by my original statements and I do apologize for that.

If we can get this bent out of shape over a sticker, I can understand why discussing politics and religion is verboten here. :devil:

That's probably good advice. Good night everyone...

 

No need to apologize! I just wanted to point out that it's been mentioned prior in the thread.

However, I am curious about your comment that you've had "plus" coins denied by CAC. What issues and in whose slab (NGC or PCGS) were they?

I asked this question earlier but no one took me up on it: what does the CAC sticker represent on a "plus" coin? The question assumes that a "plus" coin is obviously PQ, thereby rendering the CAC sticker moot, but your comment suggests this is not the case.

 

Okay, you have officially reached China. Even if your ridiculous numbers are correct, which is more profitable? Selling the coin in 7 days for $9K or selling the coin after 2 months for $10K? You remind me of the economics professor in the movie "Back to School". Brush up on your Cantonese buddy!

 

-1

 

I am not a member of CAC so I use a local dealer to send in the coins. He does this once a month and charges no premium for this service. We all share the cost of insurance and pay our share of the fee. This helps to keep the cost of insurrance down for each party. I am not aware that CAC even comments about what the issues are and I doubt that they do, but I'll make a point to ask this dealer and get back to you.

I have had both NGC and PCGS plus coins fail to be stickered. Our last batch was a count of 34 coins submitted of which only two qualified. This was the lowest performance yet and I suspect CAC has become more strict recently due to their increasing popularity. I submitted a PCGS slabbed MS65+ Walking Liberty Half Dollar in this last batch with a strike so strong it would rival the best struck examples in the 67 grade. It failed to sticker and I have no idea why.

 

This was a 1941-S Walker I submitted and if you're familliar with Walkers, you are aware that strongly struck 41-S Walkers in any grade are extremely rare.

 

Thanks for the details. By "issues" I meant coin denomination and type, so no need to pursue that!

Hard to believe the 41S PCGS 65+ Walker wasn't stickered.

 

And I would think a + wouldn't be an obvious PQ, as stated by oval_man, coin either, only that the coin has better than the numeric grade opinion but not enough for the next numeric grade.

 

That's what I thought. So let me go back to my original question: what exactly does a CAC sticker on a "plus" coin represent? Does it merely validate the "plus" (i.e., PQ) grade or does it rank the "plus" into "A," "B" and "C" levels and only sticker the "A" and "B" coins, just as it does with the grade in general?

I would think the latter (the A, B, C ranking) would be largely impossible—it would be approaching the tenths-of-a-grade accuracy level that TPGs confessed they couldn't do. So it seems to me they're only validating the "plus" or not; it's an either-or decision.

Which doesn't speak highly of TPG accuracy and consistency if we can't trust their "plus" as always denoting premium quality.

 

According to NGC's guidelines and I think PCGS's too, a "plus" grade is synonymous with PQ.

From NGC's site:
"NGC assigns a to coins at the high end of their assigned grade, approaching the quality requirements for the next grade. In addition to their superior technical merit, coins receiving a plus designation must have above-average eye appeal."

(from ctrl's post #56)

 

*SIGH* Okay, since I'm headed for China again, let's examine the rubbish you just spouted.

Those are your words in the quote above. You are talking about selling a coin in 7 days versus selling it in 2 months and asking which would be more profitable. So, at least in your example, we're assuming it's possible to flip it in 7 days. If you sell it in 7 days, you buy another coin and flip it, and repeat. In the beginning of this discussion I was talking about selling 4-8 similiar coins for $9K each, versus selling 1 coin for $10K in the same period of time.

Let's say you buy them for $8K and you only manage to sell 4 of them for $9K each, because maybe it takes you a week to buy each coin. In the end, you earn $4K profit. Or you can sell one for $10K, but you only earn $2K. So, you tell me, which is more profitable?

In all of these examples, you guys are ignoring everything I am trying to say and basically calling me an idiot because I've never ran a coin store, but yet you guys aren't doing much else besides name calling and finger pointing. None of you have demonstrated that you know anything about business, only coins, but not so much about the business aspect of coins.

But what do I know about business? I've only taken classes in accounting, entrepreneurship, small business management, economics, human resources, statistics, marketing, operations management, business finance, business law, etc. Purely on a volunteer basis, I've helped seven local businesses turn their businesses around from chronically running in the red to being profitable, despite the fact that I don't know agriculture or manufacturing or retail or healthcare, I only know business.

My point is that business is business, it doesn't matter if it's the coin business, agriculture, manufacturing, etc. If I had a dollar for every person who told me "You might know business, but you don't know the XYZ business!" - Only to later realize that as long as you have money coming in, and money going out with the ultimate goal being maximizing the amount of money that you can take home, the basic principles of business apply and only fools ignore them.

So stop telling me to brush up on my Cantonese and all this other nonsense...