How much of a premium do coins carry when certified by PCGS or NGC?

Thanks for your advice, guys! I'm definitely very happy with my purchase.

 

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Ideally no, a slabbed coin should not carry a premium over raw. However, in many cases and in today's world, slabbed coins do hold more value because the market supports this. Anyone wishing to argue this point should pick up a properly graded, common white PCGS or NGC MS65 Morgan, crack it out and see what it sells for in person or online. While the coin itself should be what matters most, it does not always work this way. All depends on who the buyer is.

 

I was at a coin shop today where the shop owner, pointing to the percentages on the "Coin Dealer Newsletter" said that those percentages from PCGS on down were how much coins routinely sell for over CDN posted prices!!! Which is to say, according to him, that if the Greysheet price was $100 on a common Walker half in MS64, then what a PCGs coin sells for is around $180... Of course those percentages are basically malarkey, I don't know anyone who pays attention to them.

Now CAC, they carry a premium.

 

Or do you mean that CAC only certifies above average quality for the grade, coins that have always carried premiums over common condition coins?

 

It seems very self explanatory to me. Many coins are purchased online these days. Anything short of excellent photography and lighting makes it all but impossible to adequately grade coins on a computer screen. Many pictures make the coin simply look shiny. It could be AU. It may be MS-64. When values can jump so high from one grade to the next, it's difficult for buyers to take every individual seller's word. Even if they are trusted veterans. They have a vested interest in trying to get as much as possible for what they are selling.

If NGC or PCGS labels a coin a MS-64, most of the time there is no argument and the market accepts it as that. Being a third party, they do not care what the coins grades. It's a third party opinion. That doesn't mean that some MS-64s are a lot nicer than other MS-64s. The buyer still has to be the judge of what should be paid for a slabbed coin based on it's quality.

It also requires time and money to get coins in a slab. The product and the authentication/verification inevitably should be worth something extra. It will certainly help sell something. Anybody that says it doesn't matter, isn't or hasn't tried selling anything.

 

Well, that is sort of a "chicken or an egg" conundrum. And the uneducated confuse who certifies or stickers a coin with the coin itself.

 

God, I have to remind myself of this often.

 

Well slabbed or not, if you're happy with the purchase thats all that counts.

 

You and I both man. This hobby has an unfortunate effect of concentrating so much on values, the beauty and enjoyment can get lost all too easily.

 

Very few people mention this important point.

 

Premium Generalities For TPG Certified Dollars

As a competitive volume buyer of "Top Tier" TPG "mint state" dollars, I can tell you there definitely is a premium. The premium logically is dependent on the coin grade, date, attributes, certifier, etc..

A general rule of thumb for generic "common date" coins is that the premium when purchased in a competitive venue is approximately slightly less than the cost required to have that "raw" coin certified/slabbed. The general premium when purchased from a dealer is relatively greater, as they will often use various unrealistic resources/documents (e.g. PCGS "price guide") to justify an appreciable premium above C.D.N. "Grey Sheet" which is normally used for acquisition.

Regardless of what dealers tell you when buying your coins, they aren't selling using the same appraisal standard. Astute buyers recognize the "game", and generally purchase in venues having competitive "premiums".

JMHO, based on significant experience. :thumb:

 

A price is something that an individual would pay for. A premium means someone paid too much for a coin because of some market relevant condition. Why anyone would pay 10x the money for a 10M+ Franklin half with wild AT is beyond me?!? To me, it's just not that special that I would have to downgrade to bottom ramen for the week.

 

Misunderstood Number, or A Dealers Favorite Tool!!

I believe the qualifying statement: "A weekly comparison of certified coin BID LEVELS relative to CDN sight seen BID LEVELS (as 100%)" somewhat clarifies these relatively nebulous numbers.

My understanding, is the following example, using the current C.D.N. "Grey Sheet" bid guides. If you brought (in pocket) an ANACS certified 1902 MS63 "mint state" $20 Gold coin, C.D.N. valued at $1865 Bid, to a dealer, and asked for a offer, he could reasonably offer you $1052 (56.42% sight seen) for the coin. He may even be gracious and offer you the maximum of $1512 (81.06% sight seen) , or the average of $1285 (68.88% sight seen) for a certified coin having a melt value of $1639 (C.D.N. published basis).

I suspect the dealer would eventually ask to see the coin, and offer slightly short of the "sight seen" price of $1865. Maybe $1675 (~90% sight seen)?

The coin has a PCGS "price guide" value of $13000.

Maybe the local dealer is a possible candidate for an average buyer?

 

I agree although if I do purchase slabbed it would be PCGS only! Post a pick of the Morgan, I would love to see it!