Question storing coins in my safe?

My safe is fire rated 2 hrs. Qusetion is that I live in Florida and humidity might be a problem I have heard in fire rated safes. Should I purchase the silicone packs to put in their and if so how do you know when to change them? Buy the way my other safe wasnt fire proof and a friend of mine in north florida just lost his house and coin collection. This is why the new safe. Thanks, Jim

 

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As GDJMSP mentions, the silica is applicable, as safes are not that tightly sealed, and the humidity inside becomes equal to the humidity in the outside air. Without extremely high price it is hard to find a rated fire/burglary safe, as fire safes have less metal ( to prevent heat transfer) and insulation designed to release steam during high heat to help reduce it. Fire safes are best located on the perimeter area of the house as the damage will be both heat and time of exposure related, and the inner core of the structure tends to burn longer. Expect plastic holders and albums to present cleanup problems afterwards. Burglary safes have thick metal walls and doors and are best to resist physical damage/opening. the locking mechanisms on fire safes are usually the bottom of the line. IMO.

 

Thankyou for the help, have ordered the recharge type, Im not really worried about fire as my home is all block, but you never know, Thanks again for the help, jim

 

Like said above, silica gel packets work good. Either opt for a 40 gram or 750 gram preferably. http://www.jpscorner.com/Silica_Gel_Desiccant.htm, i use the 750 gram but have a 3 CU ft safe, and mine is rated for 57 CU ft, so its way overkill . And in florida silica gel is especially necessary. You'll know when to re-charge because their will be a indication window with some of the silica beads in view. Blue typically means you are OK. Pink means its time to recharge. See re-activation instructions for whatever unit you choose.

 

I thought everyone in Florida had a/c?

 

Most of us do, climate control housing does help, but you can never be too safe.

 

Gallon ziploc bags will be your new friend. For items that you rarely look at, put a silica pack inside the ziploc with you coins. Best would be the previously described and a vacuum seal.

 

It looks like that link, it shows the Blue Silica Gel (Contains Cobalt Chloride) which is corrosive and toxic. Checkout: CobaltChloride.net. They do make alternatives that are Orange Silica Gel, something like this:

http://www.silicagelpackets.com/dry...ica-gel-dehumidifier-canisters-40-45-750-gram

 

wheres it say that

 

Cobalt Chloride is in the Blue Silica Gel. They aren't going to tell you that, but ask for MSDS and you should find the chemical listed in there. Checkout this site:

http://www.CobaltChloride.net

As of July 1, 2000, Cobalt Chloride is to be labeled with a toxic symbol in the United Kingdom.

 

Oh wow, and i just bought a 750gram canister a week ago....never even knew this.

 

You can actually just change out the Silica Gel if your concerned, just find someone that you can buy a few pounds of the Silica Gel that does not contain cobalt chloride and you can just dump the blue out when it turns Pink and refill with the new Orange. Here is a 2lb package:

http://www.silicagelpackets.com/loo...-mm-beads-moisture-absorber-dehumidifier.html

 

For a balanced view on the subject of Cobalt Chloride (blue) vs. Methyl violet ( orange) indicators, read this from the National Park Service, it is more understandable than a MSDS unless you are use to those publications.

http://www.nps.gov%2Fmuseum%2Fpublications%2Fconserveogram%2F02-15.pdf

The main difference , assuming you don't eat, grind,snuffle, or overheat the product, is mainly in disposal. yes, cobalt compounds disposed improperly do not readily break down, as they are inorganic substances whereas, the methyl orange indicator being organic does break down in the environment. Somewhat similar to the exotic batteries like lithium, cadmium, etc., containing units which are not generally dangerous in use, but in landfills, they can become so over time. Even some of my oil paints and pottery glazes have cadmium and other inorganics which must be delivered to the local hazardous waste area along with batteries and the fluorescent lights, and various electronic waste. I do not see any significant reason to dispose of Cobalt chloride silica devices ( which have been in use almost 60-70 years) for the Methyl Violet silica. If you are buying new stuff, your choice, but the better deal is to buy straight silica pellets and a hygrometer to measure the humidity and leave the indicators alone. IMO!.

I do not have any interest in selling such, and I actually don't rely on it myself, so no dog in the fight, just a little chem background.

Jim

 

Great post, but one question for you. Which will harm your coins more;

Blue or orange?

 

I would add one thing. Go buy some fresh silver rounds and throw in there unprotected. If you see them starting to tone you know there is an issue somewhere. Fresh silve will tone before about anything else I know of, so in that way is a good "canary" to use. Who cares if bullion tones or not, but you want to know what is going on before your coins are affected.

If the bullion tones, either trade them with the dealer for new ones, (with a few bucks), or simply put them in your silver pile and buy new silver rounds to protect your coins. Some may disagree with this suggestion, but I have found a couple of times a new sulphur source in my safe because of this loose silver.

 

Most of the chemical objections to the cobalt chloride ( and I do respect the environment ) is improper disposal when someone is finished with them. Used properly, and not pried open for curiosity, sniffed, baked at 450 with cookies, etc. Just common sense, both will serve their purpose as humidity indicators and removing water vapor. More coin damage is done by the owner not noticing results, and regenerating the silica. As medoraman mentioned, a sacrifical coin is an excellent indicator, as it indicates a chemical problem. Since I store paper money in my safe, and I want some humidity for that not to be damaged, I use bright new post 1982 cents, scrubed to brightness , such as with a brillo pad, in the safe. Fresh copper with the patina removed is also a great reactant with sulfur or other chemicals in the air. If one turns RB-ish , it is replaced. Some of you will recognize this as the underlying mechanism for Intercept(tm) products.

By the way, if you worry about either silica paks, take a hole punch and punch several holes in a ziplock bag and put the silica pack in that. Any leakage of silica or indicator particles will be in the bottomn of the bag when you remove to recharge. Always dispose of the bag when the zipper dies in a proper hazardous waste container. IMO.

 

Do you mean when the owner does not recharge the unit when the beads are pink?

Also can i just use a regular 2012 red cent fresh out of a roll?

 

Yes, I mean not checking. Usually people do when they first have the units, but life happens and months later they open the safe to get something our and find it needs recharging.

Any post 1982 that are copper clad will work fine. Out of a roll or out of circulation will work if scrubbed up harshly. These cents, even fresh out of a roll will have some patina on the surface. Removing it is like waving cheese pizza at a dog. bad chemicals attach and reat with it. Due to laws of diffusion/equilibrium, when the cent reacts with say a sulfide radical, then equilibrium will shift another into the empty area, and when that reacts, another will shift in, etc, etc. so the overall amount in the safe will decrease and your other coins with some patina will be better protected. But the poor "red" sacrificial cent will start turning first golden, then red brown then brown. I would replace or rescrub before red brown. It depends on how clean your local air is how often you need to do this, but it is an easy job.

Silica collects moisture, not the corrosive compounds. True, the more moisture you have, the easier for the reactions to occur, but if you remove the corrosive compounds from the air, there will also be less reactions. Both the silica ( with or without indicator ~ reheat when your scrubbed cent turns) and the cent will increase your protection.

You can do the same putting a bare scrubbed copper clad cent in 2x2 boxes, slab boxes, where-ever you store coins in or out a safe to limit reactants and keeping your red cents red longer. IMO.

Jim

 

I'm sure the others have answered your question sufficiently but here is my 2 cents. I use a rechargeable "DryPack" desiccants in my safe but I also use a golden rod (or a dry rod). These will raise the ambient temperature in the safe. The temperature doesn't have to be much warmer, just a few degrees to battle the humidity. I have had no complaints since using these two together, and only have to recharge (re-dehydrate) my desiccant about once every two months.