Hey gang! I picked this up this afternoon. I thought it was neat and wanted to share. These spanish coins were captured by the English and the counter stamped with King George III and monetized as crowns.... or that is how I understand it anyways.
Originals of this coin gave rise to the limerick - "The Bank (of England) in order to make its money pass, stamped the head of a fool on the neck of an ass." Just looking I see traces of what could be plating. I would suggest weighing the coin and comparing to a real piece of eight. http://www.coincommunity.com/articles/swamperbob_8_reales_birmingham_counterfeit.asp
I hope you didn't pay much, because this coin is a cast counterfeit. It has all the signs. The only question is: Is it a genuine C/S on a fake host coin, or are both the coin and C/S fake.
I certainly see evidence that it is not an official host coin but it is not a 'cast' copy. You can not cast Sheffield plate. The 'real' fakes as discussed in the link I posted were struck from fake dies. The article mentions that there are some real counterstamps used on fake hosts and those would seem to me to be the most interesting of the choices. I'd think they should be worth more than the real Spanish coins. It would seem to be a place where a hardcore collector interested in the matter would want a real coin, a fake but unmarked coin, a real c/m on real coin, a real c/m on fake and a fake c/m on fake but I'm not sure who out there is qualified to make the call between the last two groups. To me, the part of this that is interesting is the note that the first fakes were made with the support of the British government to destabilize the Spanish economy. Does that make them quasi-official English coins? I don't collect modern coins but this is the sort of thing that could make me look past my ordinary limits. The idea of the c/m makes the coin interesting but the plated version is even more so. I hope you find a buyer who will appreciate it rather than thinking of it as a fake.
I didn't even consider the possibility of it being a Sheffield plate piece. I've read many of swamperbob's articles and posts over the years and even sent him a few contemporary counterfeits. He always mentioned the Sheffield plate type to be very hard to come by and, if I remember correctly, only personally acquired one this past year. The plating explains what I saw as casting signs. Except for the O above the M in the mint mark. It is a filled in dot rather than an open o, which is something I've seen on cast copies.
The signs of casting i can see are shrinkage lines just outside the c/m and some raised dots outside the bust of caroltus. also the inside of the c/s is not sharply defined. i think the beading at the 4 of carolus is where the metal was poured into the mold.
No, dougsmit is spot on. From a quick look and not having this type of counterfeit in mind, it surely appears cast. Got me too. =)
Interesting story, indeed. But the host doesn't look right, and the field of the c/s doesn't look right, either.
i have closely scrutinised the coin and yes gentlemen i agree this coin is a counterfeit, the obverse bobble marks and the marks on the reverse including the line from et in the legend to the centre appears to go underneath the shield to the centre.
