UPDATE: What I heard from the Vending Industry

Okay, I got a few interesting tidbits here that, both coin and currency dealers may like.

First off, I talked to a lady from NAMA, and she told me that the Treasury is looking at such options as Braille as well as different sized banknotes, or possibly corner cut off in certain spots on certain denominations, but was not sure of any changes being made to the $2 bill (which I don't see being possible, since ALL denominations except the $1 bill were ordered to be redesigned) But the BEP lady said there were no plans to redesign the $2 bill as of yet, but they are not sure if that will change or not, so its still possible.

As for coins, the government IS looking for cheaper metals for our coinage. The lady mentioned a redesign, but I am guessing what she meant by "redesign" was a change in metal composition, but I suggested my half dollar redesign idea (No, not the "Famous Dogs" series. Just the size reduction and shape and possible color change) but she said it was ultimately up to the U.S. Mint and Bureau of Engraving & Printing on making bills and coins for their machines to accept. But although she said, they are trying to make it so that the least amount of retooling is needed, she did make it sound like a totally new coin mechanism was going to need to be developed. So I asked her, "If you guys have to develope a new coin acceptor, could you please make it so that it accepts and dispenses halves?" and she said, "Well, I don't know. Halves don't really circulate too well, and we think its for the same reason that the dollar coin failed: Because consumers did not want another coin added into their daily commerence" and I told her "No, the problem with the dollar coin, was that the government did not phase out the $1 bill, and the dollar coin will not circulate as long as we have a $1 bill, however, the $2 bill does not have a $2 coin to compete with, and the half dollar coin doesn't have a $0.50 bill to compete with, so they have more of a chance" and she said, "You're right" and then I said, I don't think they will ever get rid of the $1 bill. They've been trying, what? 40+ years?" and she said "Neither do I" So, if this is coming from the vending industry, which advocates coin usage, including the dollar coin and eliminating the $1 bill, obviouly THEY too, know that the dollar coin is never going to work out. Which is why they should push for the halves and $2 bills to circulate more, since there are a lot of vending itemd going for $1.65 or so. So either insert a $2 bill and get $0.35 back in change, or insert a $1 bill and a half, a dime and a nickel, and call it a day.

I was also told by the BEP that these issues are up to the Federal Reserve Board. But I plan on contacting as many self checkout and vendors as possible, to urge that they upgrade to accept $2 bills and accept and dispense halves as needed. Whether I succeed, is yet to be seen, but if they have to make all new machines, there is, or should be a glimmer of hope, to get the machines made to accept these two odd denominations.

Since there is no chance for the dollar coin, it is time for the HALF dollar coin to shine again!

 

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Do you realize that you are alone against 300 million people that don't want anything to do with half dollar coins?

Boy, you have quite the long row to hoe!

 

Not sure if the arguments posited in your posting are logically sound. Seems you are saying you had a discussion with a person who works in the vending machine industry.

You set forth several arguments for your point of view, and she said, "okay." From her failure to challenge your comments, you jump to the conclusion that a vending machine industry insider with working knowledge of the US Mint's plans has informed you that the dollar coin will never work.

Sounds more like this vending machine person was just having a nice conversation, rather than imparting privileged information about the future of American coinage.

 

As a collector, I like half dollars (and cents) but as a consumer I don't like them too much. Why are you calling on vendors to spend thousands of dollars for their vending and self-checkout machines to dispense halves when they are already equipped to easily dispense two quarters? I would venture to say that your calling vendors is in vain and that they may well laugh about you after they've hung up with you. Yes, the dollar coin has lost to the dollar bill but that is because that is what the American people by and large wish to use. Why should the dollar bill be phased out forcing everyone to use dollar coins when a meager 0.001% of the population even cares about using them in their daily commerce?

As a side note, I believe that changing currency to accomodate blind or visually impaired people is an uneccessary move initiated by activists as the technology already exists to help them. They can use convenient, hand-held scanners to read and detect what currency denominations they have.

 

The problem is that almost all purchases are made with plastic. The vending machine is no exception. The companies would rather put money and effort into creating machines that could read ATM and CC instead of coins. Also the only vending machine I know that consistently circulates 1 dollar coins are the MTA machines. At least we call them MTA in NY, don't know about other states.

 

For the same reason that the vending and self checkout machines would have to dispense two dimes and a nickel, if the quarter wasn't there. And for multi-million dollar industries, does it REALLY matter if they invest a "few" more million dollars to make their machines accept ALL "legal tender" coins and currency denominations? And by that, I mean all CURRENT coins and currency. Not like old $500 bills (unless they reissue them) or old large Eisenhower dollar coins or Gold Eagles, and, well, you get the point.

There is nothing wrong with supporting a wide circulating half dollar or $2 bill, just like there is nothing wrong with advocating for a reissue of $500 and $1,000 bills and the issuance of a $200 bill.

 

The trend, I think, is to get away from using coins or banknotes in vending machines all together. It's costly to modify the machines every time the mint changes the coinage. I can see North American companies adopting the European model where the machines are activated by cell phones or plastic cards (bank, debit, credit etc.). It'll be far cheaper and easier to change.

 

I'm sure they will appreciate your input and give it all the weight it deserves.
:desk:

 

However, this is not entirely accurate. The fact that the dollar coin and dollar bill are both produced and placed into circulation, or "competing as you state, really has nothing to do with the failure of one over the other.

It's public acceptance of the coin versus the bill. This same non-acceptance, publicly, is a repeat occurance when the Morgan dollars were released in 1878. The public didn't like them then, just as much as they are not liking the Sacs and POTUS dollars today.

Would it really help the popularity of the dollar coins, if the bills were no longer printed? I doubt it. People would take increments of $5 or $10 to a bank and exchange them for $5 and $10 notes, much like people did during the Morgan years, turned them in for good ole' greenbacks.

 

To clarify, while I don't actually "like" the fact that this is true, I think you're right. Cash for commerce is simply on its way out.

The vending machines where I work recently sprouted card readers, along with a placard touting the virtues and convenience of "cashless" transactions. A few weeks later, they were also displaying shiny new prices, generally 10-20 cents higher than before. After all, you don't suppose the credit card companies are going to give up those per-transaction merchant fees, do you?

 

I agree... same as the slot machine industry. I rarely visit a casino, but the last time I was there I was shocked at how quiet it was; then I realized there were no coins dropping from the machines. No coins in and no coins out... just a card and a receipt.

 

Well, from what I've heard, cash has at LEAST two more generations to go, and that is a very long time. Plus, face it, not everyone is going to go for a cashless society. What will people do that are buying privately owned vehicles, or going to garage/yard sales? Those people are not going to buy a machine, just so that someone a swipe a card through it, and be off on their way. I am 31 years old now, and I still feel there will be cash around as long as I am alive. Even if I live to see the Tricentennial.

 

It appears as though you are the only person unaware of the death of the horse!
You need a new hobby or a good psychotherapist.
Your obsession is frightening.

 

While I admire your enthusiasm, I do have a problem with this statement:

Why does the fact that if someone or some entity has money, that it should be used for the betterment of individuals or small groups, rather than the common good, especially of the company?

Because that statement, in the context of your topic, reeks of socialism.

It may not matter to you, but it may indeed, matter to them. If you make $50,000 per year, and your household expenses are $45,000 for that period, shouldn't you take the leftover money and give it to some homeless guy on the street, instead of putting it in the bank. or your IRA, or mutual fund? What would it matter, after all, you paid your bills, right? Same principle applies, although on a much larger scale. The fact that a company makes millions doesn't necessarily mean it has a few million lying about for frivolous projects that will not yield a return on the investment. Keeping in mind that even if this is possible, they would need to recoup the costs of the investment (an a profit on that outlay of cash). How would they do that? By charging higher prices, of course. The manufacturer charges the buyer additional costs, which is passed along to the machine user. Now it's costing you five of those half dollar coins instead of one. it seems pretty obvious that people prefer paper money or plastic to larger denomination coins. Personally, I carry some cash and no change unless I received it from a cash transaction (ie, from a vending machine, that accepts paper dollar bills, which goes into a jar at the end of the day). Most of my purchases are made with either my debit or credit card, especially for larger priced buys. Cash is carried for the occasional lottery tickets (in PA you have to use cash), soda and snacks from the machine, and turnpike tolls. I also carry cash to the flea markets, for obvious reasons. My 20 year old son rarely carries cash, instead prefering to make all of his purchases with his debit card. I actually saw him by a bottle of soda (and only a bottle of soda) for $1.50 with that card.

Like someone else said, it's you (figuratively, but still a small minority) against the large number of people who want bills rather than coins for commerce. What you're asking is for the industry and the government to force an idea on people not willing to accept it. If I remember, we still live in a democracy. And our society is still a capitalist one, so making money is still okay.

 

Cash will be around for a long, long time. But, that doesn't mean it use will stay the same or diminish. There are many advantages to using a card rather than cash, at least for the consumer. But for commerce, card use makes some sense. It's far easier and safer to move larger sums of money electronically, instead of with cash. And the technology is there for the flea market people to accept credit or debit card purchases via wi-fi and cellular networks connecting to the internet. I have seen this at some of the larger outdoor (and indoor) craft shows. Most flea market vendors and private auto transactions are cash (and I suspect you already know this) because there is no paper trail, and thus no taxes to be paid. In addition, most of these people want to maximize their profit, no matter how shady, in the same manner that people gripe about and look for ways around eBay and Paypal fees.

 

Currently there are companies (Square, Intuit) that offer cell phone credit card readers that plug into some smart phone. I have one and it works very well when my wife sets up at craft fairs and ppl want to pay with a CC. You can send ppl an email receipt of their purchase. 2.75% fee and accepts all types of cards. The reader is free to get

 

Hey buddy, no reason for the snide remarks. I'm just a person from a younger generation, that missed out, when halves, $2, $500, $1,000, $5,000 and $10,000 bills circulated, and I would like to be able to enjoy those times and freedoms myself, just like some of the elder members on this board remember getting to do. Now, is that such a crime?


But there is NO crime in trying to get halves to circulate again. If what I am doing is so wrong, was it wrong when the government circulated halves in the past.

Also, I do NOT believe that the reason halves do not circulate, is because "People do not want to deal with "large denomination" coins" It is because most vending and self checkout machines do not accept them, and also, banks do not hand out halves (or $2 bills) as needed, which creates an even bigger problem. And if people can deal with two quarters, they sure as H:devil:ll can deal with ONE half, especially seeing as, even though its not by much, but, one half weighs slightly less than two quarters, and if it were redesigned the way I stated it should be, it woiuld be even WAY lighter.

So do not give me this LANGUAGE that perople do not want halves or $2 bills, because you do not know that for a fact, seeing as they never see circulation, due to banks not handing them out as needed, and different machines not dispensing them. I believe by trying to get these two denominations circulating, I am doing what is in the best interest for now, seeing as a half has twice the purchasing power of a quarter, and the dollar coin continues to be a flop. And I do not believe people would mind carrying another coin around, so long as it is a "fraction" of a dollar, and not something that has a paper bill to compete with.

And another thing. Europe has a sucessfully circulating 50 cent Euro and 2 cent Euro coin, so, what if I were to even go so far as to say "Bring back the U.S. 2 cent coin?" Obviously 50 cent coins do come in handy in some places, so why not here, in the U.S.?

 

I daresay very few of us old-timers can say they can remember circulating $5000 and $10000 bills.
The largest bill I ever saw in circulation was a $500 and that was more than 50 years ago.
Half dollars did circulate back in the day but their use faded out in the 1970s.
$2 bills still circulate - I know because I use them all the time.

 

Would like to point out that some Euro zone countries have stopped using the 1c coin even though they still in principle make them (mainly for collectors market)

Please do try to keep the thread civilized and jibe free

 

Well, I figured that, because, back then $5,000 or $10,000 was a lot of money.

Still must have been a neat thing to see.

Only, supposedly, because the silver content was not removed from the half at the same time as it was from the quarter and dime, and I believe that, had the half went to copper clad back then, they would still be circulating. From all of the hoarding for the next five years, that killed people's habits of being used to halves in the future, so all they need is another boost to get them popular, which would be, banks handing them out as needed, and vending and self checkout machines accepting and dispensing them as needed, as I have repeated over and over on different coin websites.

Yes, I've heard that the $2 bill IS slowly regaining popularity, although I do not know where, as I have never received one in change. But if the $2 bill IS making a comeback, then so can the half. If you do spend $2 bills, then like me, you should also spend halves. And while I like spending dollar coins, they do not interest me as much as $2 bills or halves.