A modern cast counterfeit with cartwheel luster.

I'm aware of the old adage that cast coins do not have cartwheel luster. However, this one looks pretty clearly to be cast and also appears to have cartwheel luster like struck coins. And this one is not is not being sold from China, but rather an ex-soviet NIS (Newly Independent State).

http://www.ebay.com/itm/UNITED-STATES-AMERICA-1-DOLLAR-1896-SILVER-COIN-VF-/160692798291?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item256a098353

And in case the listing gets shut down like another that I recently posted, here is the pic:

From the listing: "Authentic: Yes" LOL! =)

 

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are fakes like these actual silver, or is that faked too?

 

Sometimes they are full assay silver, but those are typically better quality struck fakes. These are usually made of alloys that are not as dense as silver.

 

That is one of the worst fakes I've seen. The manufacturer of this piece should be ashamed of himself.

 

Honestly I don't see anything wrong. Maybe it just because I don't collect Morgans, but what exactly makes this fake?

 

I don't collect them either, but:

1) Texture.
2) Denticles. Check the irregularities at 8, 10, and just past 12 o'clock on the reverse.
3) The big bottle-cap flange around the obverse rim.

 

I see some shine, I don't see luster. They are NOT the same thing.

And it IS a poor quality fake.

 

Give me that fake and 5 minutes on a polishing wheel and I could create enough luster to fool a photo taken that far away. A lack of luster should be used to red flag a coin, but any idiot can whiz a coin, so apparent, (from a poor photo) luster should never be used to prove authenticity.

Chris

Edit: Btw I didn't mean to disparage your post Dmitry, I think it was a good point to bring up about photos and fakes.

 

Not good quality at all.

 

glad that it's not from a seller in the usa

 

It appears to me that it does have cartwheeling luster. When you have that brighter shine on directly opposing areas, and dark, almost black color in between.
This is what I always look for when buying coins from not-so-good photos and it works. The polished shine looks quite different, it doesn't have that straight line of reflection, it's just evenly shiny all around.

I agree with you guys that it may not be original to the casting, but it's there now. =)

 

I am just saying, be careful. I am not talking about regular polishing, but whizzing like they did in the 70's before TPG to fool buyers dumb enough to not use a loupe. To a certain extent, cartwheeling can be replicated enough for a photo. I am not talking the garage type hack job, but will not mention the better way.

I am sure a lot of the old guys who did it are gone, but I in fact know there still are people who know how to do it. I was shown in the early 80's, it was another way to hide damaged coins, (of course it just further damaged them).

Just spreading information sir. I am sure you have used this fact successfully many times, just warning you there are ways to defeat that tactic, especially in poor photos. Always use a loupe when you get the coin in hand.

Chris

 

Oh dear.

 

Thanks for the cautionary note Chris. I've ended up with coins that were very finely whizzed, but did not appear so in the photos. So yea, I know exactly where you are coming from. =)

 

At 1st look it seemed to be a poor fake. Such a pity that this drek can show up on ebay. But it can be critiqued here, on Ct, so we can straighten some things out.