Two MPL's (matte proof Lincolns). Which do you prefer and guess the grades!

One is in an NGC slab, one in PCGS. One merits a gem grade, the other a couple of points lower. One gets BB'd, the other grades cleanly.

Guesses? If you don't care to guess, which do you prefer?
Lance.

 

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Pretty cool thread Lance. I'll go first I guess.

From what I can see from the pictures, I will step out and say that the NGC slabbed 1913 looks like a MS 63 from what I am used to seeing. If it is body bagged it is due to what looks like a wipe on the reverse or the spot on the lapel has a halo around it that can signify a recolor job.

The PCGS 1909 would surely grade higher than 63 and if it doesn't, it would be due to the bold color. You know as well as I do that there isn't any true guidelines the TPG's use to follow when it comes to color, and it wouldn't surprise me at all if it BB for color.

I would say I PREFER the 1909 simply because of the matte fields alone. The 1913 looks to be lacking that and why else own one unless it is there? Although I own some business strike Lincoln cents that have similar attributes like this, I can see these MPLs as both being market market acceptable on any given day.

JMO Matt

 

Even though I think the Pcgs got BB that's the one I would prefer

 

Well, I thought there'd be more interest in this. I guess not.

The NGC coin graded PF63. I'll probably leave it alone. It has an interesting strike-through on the reverse on the reverse at the D in UNITED. A bit of fabric, I guess, from cleaning up the die with a rag.

The PCGS MPL got body-bagged for cleaning. Not sure I understand this one. There are no hairlines. If they objected to a dip-and-retone then call it color or questionable surfaces. I'm going to resubmit this one. I'm not buried in it so if it genuines again I'll just enjoy it as it is.

Doug, I'm with you. Coppermania, you hit the nail on the head.
Lance.

 

I would go for 1909 Mat Proof, I had a chance to acquire one once and did not, I went for tha 1909s au then, I did not know,what I know now. Nice coins. The 1913 Mat Proof to me, doesn't look as a Mat Proof. It's just doesn't have the texture on the flat surfaces. The 1913 is a nice coin, other wise. Later, I see the tone of a dip.

 

If I had the choice to purchase any one of the two coins, I would purchase the 1909. I am not a big fan of toning, but it looks way better than the '13.

The 1909 was free of problems and graded MS65
The 1913's colors look a bit off in my opinion, so I think it ended up as MS Details

 

Wow! That is a couple of 'beauties!

 

I agree with coppermania. I definitely prefer the 1909 even though I can believe it has been cleaned. I would even say that only the obverse has been cleaned. Look how the recesses on the obverse do not have the shine (luster?) that the fields have. I have no idea what they did, but I believe they did something.

 

I prefer the '09 MPL. I too don't understand why it got a body-bag... I've seen coins that look scrubbed with steel wool and hit with the backside of a hammer come outta PCGS labeled 65! :dead-horse:

-Brian

 

couple of beauties

Hello lkeigwin,

I was in coin chat for the last couple days & I never saw this thread until today. Perhaps it was maybe more than 10 threads down in the list where I never looked. Sorry I missed it. They are both really nice coins.

I was going to say that I like the NGC coin better than the PCGS coin. The PCGS coin's color reminded me of having a past experience with MS70. Before I had a chance to review this first impression of the coins, I read further only to see that it was a 2-day old thread!

 

Ngc will turn away a lot of coins.spot are one thing that has turned back a lot of copper coins for sure.

 

Lance, I think the 1909 is beautiful. I hope you eventually get it to grade out.

 

Well I don't know about grading them, but I think the 1903 was BB'd, but regardless, I think the 1909 kinda looks cleaned then AT'd. I don't really like the way the toning developed around the legend on the obverse. And by I don't like I mean that's what makes me think it's AT. Both beautiful coins.

 

I bit my tongue the first time I saw this thread as I didn't want to make the OP unhappy, and just decided to wait to post...

I prefer coin #1.

Coin #2 just looks "off". Obverse much brighter than reverse. Toning a bit odd for a MPL. Can't quite put my finger on it -- just looks "off".

 

The 1913 looks completely natural....nice coin!

I see why they rejected the 1909. the toning is uneven and suspect. It looks odd around the back of the head, LIBERTY and the date. On the reverse it's odd looking around the E PLUR area which may indicate an old light, cleaning. From what I've seen of these, the toning is usually pretty even and follows a nice progression of colors.

 

Considerate of you, Leadfoot. But I am not offended by opinions. At least they're free here. PCGS makes me pay for theirs. LOL.

I was at the Santa Clara show today and almost bit on a 1914 65BN MPL. It was very alluring. But I found a really nice '13-S MS65RB I had been searching for a long time, and a 1795 Liberty Cap VF20 with wonderful surfaces. So I spent all my money on those.

Foot traffic at the show was better than I expected, given the conflict with Stack's Baltimore show. But my favorite dealers were absent.

Funny...the biggest crowd was at the PCGS tables. All these dealers and collectors with identical 15 lb. boxes. What do you think was in them?
Lance.

 

Let's see those two new beasts, Lance (post photos) ... They sound great

 

Okay, WL. Here's the '13-S, to keep it Lincoln-topical.
Lance.