Buying from dealers at a show.

I understand the urge to get that 7070 filled, but I'd be willing to take a little extra time - especially with the two Seated and the Trade Dollars. I'd look at as many as I can at the show to get a feel for prices and relative grades. I think slabbed is a good idea, but if you can find one raw, I wouldn't necessarily rule it out. But the main thing is, don't buy until you feel good about what you are buying. A little extra time is worth taking with these.

 

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Your in Michigan right?

 

Yes. Michigan. The show is in Troy MI

 

You have your work cut out for you. These are tough coins to find nice. For several reasons, I would suggest you just look rather than buy at this show.

I would not suggest "offering" them anything. I would suggest asking for their "cash price" or "best price" and agreeing to it or not.

Depends on the dealer. Frankly, you're better off just focusing on the coin and the price and ignoring the grade. Arguing about a dealer's grading is a losing proposition and equally as successful as telling a new mother her baby is ugly.

That's not a bad guide, but IMO you should pass or play based on the coin and the price -- not what a guide tells you. If you really want a guide as to what you're going to have to pay for a nice trade or seated dollar on the bourse, you'd be better off looking at PCGS price guides as a low estimate. The point being you will not find a nice example for price guides. Said a bit differently, finding a nice example of either ones of these coins is so difficult it will make you pay just about anything (within reason) when you find the right one. If you want a dipped, stripped, or possibly worse example, stick to the unslabbed ones which you will undoubtedly find for sheet values.

You will get taken for a ride if you're a noob or an expert. IMO, it's better to just be honest.

1. Find an experienced collector that's also going to the show and who doesn't mind you following them around.
2. Don't buy anything. Just look and listen. Don't be afraid to tell the dealers what you're looking for if they ask.
3. If you must buy something, figure out what you want and how much you're willing to spend BEFORE THE SHOW. For instance, I want an original looking trade dollar in XF for $250 (lol).
4. Try and figure out which dealers are the "good" dealers and which are the "bad" dealers. See #1 for who can point you in the right direction. As a noob, you want to stick to the "good" dealers -- but be forewarned even the best of dealers has bad coins.
5. BE PATIENT. If you don't find the right coin this time, it's not the end of the world. The two coins you are looking for are TOUGH coins. I've been on the hunt for both of them for more than five years -- and I still don't have a seated dollar.

Good luck & I hope this helps...Mike

 

Ill be there! Its Sunday only but it will be the best one until the Spring show! A very close dealer of mine thats pushing 1000 years old is going to be there and if you want I can ask him to grab some specifics out of his vault for you to look at.Most of his stuff is in old holders and he dont charge any more than current prices. Just let me know!

 

Oh and I almost forgot...There are door prizes every ten minutes and Polish Cuisine!!!!

 

Leadfoot... Thank you for the very informative post. I was in such a rush to get the album filled, but I really don't know why. As some of you may noticed, I have been purchasing and posting many coins for the album lately. I have only 10 empty holes now, and I think they can stay empty while I research, look around, and I am able to make an informative decision. I need to slow my roll...

Heck yeah! Last years PANS show was my first and only show I have ever been to. Love the food!

 

Sage advice.

When you're looking for a tough and rare coin, you don't have any negotiating power. Most dealers will give you their best price right away and it does no good to try and talk them down. If you don't buy it, the next guy probably will and they know it. I can't tell you how many times that's happened to me with Lincolns. If it's a tough coin, rarely seen in a given condition, you can toss ALL of the price guides out the window. I've known dealers to sit on coins for YEARS until that magic buyer finally comes to them.

 

It's tough to not get excited about seeing (and potentially buying) coins at a show. Your best advice may have been your own words - "I need to slow my roll...".

I've only been to a couple of shows. The best thing about each of them had nothing to do with buying (so far). It was the conversation. Some dealers are more willing to talk than others. I want them to know that I'm not very educated about the coins I am looking at. And I don't want them to think I'm trying to pull a fast one by saying as much.

The conversation on this board the tip of the coin knowledge iceberg.

 

These are tough coins to buy, and you made the right decision to not buy them raw. Few US coins are faked more than Seated and Trade dollars.

Also, few coins are more played with than these, finding truly original pieces is a challenge. I'm not familiar with Trade Dollars, but an XF seated dollar should run you, for a common date in nice, truly original condition, a bit over greysheet ask, which is about $430 last I checked. Even though they may be slabbed, lots of these have been dipped, cleaned, scratched, etc.

I do have a small pile of seated dollars, I like them with a very specific and original look in the VF-XF range.

My suggestion is to start doing research on them, start looking at coins, find a dealer or two who specialize in them and knows them. Be patient, you're not likely to go to a typical regional show and just come across a nice VF-XF one in a slab.

Probably more of the same for the Trade Dollars, but a nice slabbed AU can be had in the mid $600s last I checked, a friend of mine has one for sale on the BST "around the corner" in a PCGS slab right now, a flashy white AU58 that's a nice coin if you like White.

 

When haggling, it also helps when you know if you are dealing with the business owner or one of his hapless employees. Hapless employees, for obvious reasons, tend to be much less flexible when it comes to offering discounts...

 

So I went to the show this past sunday. I wasn't succesful at pruchasing or even looking at any trade or seated dollars. Why you ask? Well mostly because the show was very crowded and it was hard to even get in at a table to sit down and look. As it turned out, I had to have the kids with me also. It was a little overwhelming because of the sheer amount of coins to look, coupled with the crowd and the noise. I felt 'rushed' the whole time, having to keep an eye on the kids as well. I did end up snatching up 6 Jefferson toners though. I couldn't leave without buying something!

I appreciate all of the advice and comments given in this thread. I have been rushing to finish the 7070 the last few weeks for no apparent reason. I am now going to slow down and take my time on the last 10 coins. I will feel much more comfortable going to the coin shop and sitting down and discussing the coins with the dealer one on one for the remainder.

 

If you can't grade them or determine if these coins are real or not you shouldn't be buying raw coins at all. Buy a slabbed one and then crack it and put it in your album. You can always send it back in.

 

Agreed.

 

You should PM LostDutchman he may have just what you're looking for .
rzage

 

One way to find a fake that has iron in it, such as one made from steel, is to use a magnet. I always carry a magnet with me, and whenever we are looking at silver coins, I touch the magnet to them. Also, if you know the weight of the coin you want, weigh the coin you are considering. Very small scales (about the size of an iPhone or pack of cigarettes) cost around ten dollars on eBay, and they work great.