As far as what "people say" is concerned, I don't believe it. Some say the penny is dead. Others say we will be a cashless society. I pick up pennies and don't care who sees me do it even if it's just one! The penny, IMHO, will continue to be produced with whatever material that will allow the US Mint to show a profit. Even when they can't make a profit on the cent and/or nickel, just look at the profit made in coining the other denominations. If anything should be trimmed from our monitary system, it should be the paper dollar (circulating life expectancy measured in months vs. coin = 30yrs+). Once the paper bill is unfit for circulation it is sent to be destroyed (cost incurred) and then replaced (another cost incurred). This cycle of print-destroy-reprint is repeated over 25 times while a dollar coin goes bumping and banging in pockets, cash drawers, etc. for 30 or more years. Check your change and see if you find coins minted before 1981. If you didn't today, perhaps tomorrow. Now check wallet and see if you find any series of bills that go back that far. Most of what you'll find is what's been printed from the last series of that denomination. And to those who claim the "weight issue" how often do you have 20 $1 bills in your wallet? While were revamping things, lets get rid of the dead people on our money and return to design ideas like the Mercs, educational notes and such. These were beautiful works of art not ugly like the present incarnation of Thomas Jefferson on the nickel, SBA's, IKE's, et al.
I totally agree with you about the dollar. Like I said we've had the 1 and 2 dollar coins in Canada for a long time now, and it's never necessary to carry more than one or two of them in your pocket at any one time. (Not to mention, more coins to collect!)
Yep...US should have: Coins, Dime, Quarter, half, dollar, 2 dollar Bills, 5, 10, 20, 50, 100, 500 and 1k I'm just saying
Besides, if they do finally eliminate the dollar they will print more $2.00 bills. At least that's my understanding.
I agree that the penny is useless, but I'm not sure if the cost to mfr it is a factor. I would think that since the same one can be used over and over the real cost is a fraction of the mfg. cost. Regarding tenths in gasoline pricing. That's just a marketing ploy, a digit on a sign. If the tenths were used we would see prices with 2/10, 4/10, 7/10 or whatever was needed. We don't see random tenths, it's always 9/10 and the price is changed in full cents every single time. Who uses dollar coins? I do. I dispense them at my car washes. They work great and I don't annoy customers with a bunch of quarters they didn't want. A dollar is change now. The paper version needs to go and production of the $2 bill we already have could be ramped up to appease the ones with the silly attatchment to the greenback.
Actually, all coins can be replaced with notes. It costs very little to print and distribute paper. And the government has a history of using fractional notes in MPCs for military payroll. I imagine the conversion would take a week or two, but banks and people who handle money would love it. gary
Saw in the paper this morning that yesterday a committee than Ron Paul is chairman of considered as the article said, "such mundane issues as the amount of zinc in a penny".
I think that's a good part of the problems we face today is the rewriting of recent history. Presidents such as Reagan are lauded for his "conservative" ideology. But it's forgotten how his administration brought illegal drugs to our inner cities to finance the illegal arms deals to countries we were supposed to have embargos against. His administration also did much to control our ownership of guns after Brady was shot. The attempt to eliminate unions which thusly deprived millions of retirement and health care benefits contributed greatly to the national health care problem today. Truthfully, I guess you can only understand it from the "bottom" level if you lived through it. The oil fiasco, first gulf war for oil. Hunts and the silver. etc. Changes in tax laws that moved more tax dollars to a few at the top. Payments to industries to move operations overseas as part of our foreign aid programs. Seances, etc. I can say, I have lived through the excitement of Viet Nam, Tet Offensive, Cuban Missile Crisis, Oil Embargo, Continuous hot and cold war over oil in the mideast, NAFTA, Ollie North, etc. It's been quite a ride. lol gary
The seances were particularly troubling! :smile I'm old enough to have lived through a lot of that ride; e.g., was too young for Nam but hung around with some older friends who told me their Nam stories. Some of that time seems like ancient history to me (the 70's, the 80's; even the 90's is starting to be). Things move and change so quickly. Now we're in the digital age and it's an entirely different world. As for the rewriting of history and the problems we face today, that's another whole topic I'll let be for now!
The demise of strong labor unions has caused a shifting of health care and retirement burden to tax dollars. When the government has to provide what private business fails to, more money must be put into circulation. That drives the value of a cent downward while the costs rise due to inflation. It;s a double whammy, making small coinage not worth the effort and expense of handling. History has shown that countries with strong labor union/government seperation have stronger economies. This produces a strong currency, etc. IMHO gary
I often use the "Snicker's bar" analogy when discussing this topic because when I was young, that was my favorite candy bar...still is! Anyway, in 1964 you could go into any store in the country and buy a Snicker's bar for 5¢. Today, you're lucky to find a Snicker's bar for 99¢. You'll find that price relationship holds true (on average) for most goods. So, if $1 today has the same purchasing power of a 1964 nickel, then today's nickel has the purchasing power of 1/4th of a 1964 penny. The penny today has the purchasing power of 1/20th of a 1964 penny. In fact, the closest coin we have to the 1964 penny is today's quarter!! Oftentimes, when folks wax nostalgic about losing the penny, they're thinking about what a penny "used" to be worth...before we went to clad coinage. I love the penny, too...but it's time to "let it go". You're not going to lose anything of significance if the penny, nickel, AND dime go bye-bye. Producers will just put a few more raisins in the Raisin Brand to give you a fair value. :secret:...(let it go!)
What difference does it make if a company steals five pennies from us or one nickel. Maybe the greater efficiency will satiate the CEO sooner.
How do you think the world operated 50 years ago...back when coins had value? The world still operated on supply and demand. If Product-X raised its price from 5¢ to 6¢ and Product-Y stayed at 5¢, there had better be something other than price to get the consumer to choose Product-X (more product, higher quality...something!) or Product-X would sit on the shelf. The same is true today, but instead of the products being 5¢ vs. 6¢ they're now $1.00 vs. $1.20...how much is a penny really worth today? Question: When you leave the house each day, do you return with more, less, or about the same amount of coins in your pocket? ...assuming you pay cash for everything. (Answer: More) Question: When was the last time you were at the movie theater and paid the $10+ it costs for snacks...with change? (Answer: Never) Fifty years ago, coins were minted in the tens of millions...today they're minted in the multiple Billions! Yet, the US population has only doubled in size...Hmmmm. Why do you suppose? ...it's because no one spends their change; they just hoard it in coin jars...because it has no value! Fifty years ago kids never carried paper money...we all had these little rubber coins holders they gave away for free at gas stations and everything we needed cost less than a buck. The Mint's charter is to produce "Coins for Commerce"...commerce means "buying" things. We need to get rid of these cheap-azz coins and get some new ones with some real purchasing power. Might get folks more interested in coin collecting, as a result. :thumb:
I actually used halves to cover an entire tab for a movie before, just cause I had plenty I'd just gotten from a bank that were all clad. But yes, point taken... the purchasing power of our change has dropped through the floor.
Interesting. Lets do some quick back of the napkin math to see it cladkings statement here could be accurate. So lets look at the labor cost of actually having a cashier conduct a sale including pennies. With a federal minimum wage of 7.25$ an hour a cashier is paid one penny in 5 seconds so obviously if it takes longer than that to place a penny in the till from the customer or to fetch a penny from the till when making change it costs more to the business in pay for the cashier than they take in from the transaction. If we assume that on average 2.5 pennies are used per transaction the break even time rises to 12.5 seconds. Now a penny paid to the employee is not the same as a penny taken in. The penny taken in revenue also has to pay for the penny for the employee, raw materials, taxes, utility bills, leases and so on. Adjusting the 12.5 seconds based on the profit margin of 20% which is what McDonalds runs at gives us a break even time of 2.5 seconds. My guess is McDonalds still turns a profit using the penny. But for a company like WalMart with a profit margin of 3.6% if the time added to the transaction from using pennies is .45 seconds or longer they are actually paying the cashier more then the pennies the cashier exchanged. Obviously there are tons of other factors that would change these numbers but I think the jist of what cladking said is correct. In a lot of transactions using a physical penny could actually cost more.
Impressive! ...but I imagine you got them as a result of "roll searching" and were just trying to get rid of them. The theater likely sent them straight back to the bank the next day. I try to fill my pocket with change each morning and pay dollar amounts with paper money and use change for the rest. For instance, if my Burger King order is $7.86, I'll give the cashier a five and two ones...and then dig 86¢ out of my pocket. Or, even worse, I'll give the cashier a ten and say, "hold on, I got the change." I've gotten pretty good at it, but I still get the "stink-eye" from the cashier and everyone else waiting in line behind me!
Whenever I'm working the cash drawer, I love it when customers do that, it gives me a second to grab a breather and helps my change supply not run out as fast.
LOL @ "toxic slugs"! Interesting...I never considered it from that perspective, but it makes sense. :thumb:
