eBay vs rest of the coin selling world

You are making too big of a deal over that cleaned coin. it only skewed the results 15% on a $300 coin. I am getting an impression that you aren't good with math?


BTW I totally understand where you are coming from - DO NOT MISUNDERSTAND MY INTONATIONS. They are not directed at you personally. Service, turst, communication and a personal touch is a value that a lot of people are willing to pay extra for - some think it should be included in the price - others don't respect it. To each his own and that is cool to me!

I too am building/have those relationships. It would be absolutely nuts of me to buy from eBay and only eBay and shun every other method out there.

This whole thread is based on setting an example on how to back up unfounded unsubstantiated claims and opinions.

I never ever have a problem admitting that I am wrong when it is proven to me.

I picked certified examples to compare between the venues. Certified examples ie. GRADING LABELS - on the average are 20% less on eBay when compared to TT

Grading Labels are a very apples to apples comparison. BTW did you ever post any of the auction house results for that 1875 coin?

Pick another coin that you value under $500 ? exceptions are the popular key dates Give me the search criteria including what you don't want included like cleaning, raw or certified You know what key words are? Give the the wording that is used to typically describe a coin. You produce the auction house results and I will provide the eBay results...

I see that you did post another coin, my apologies, for not reading all the posts. I will be happy to research that COIN later tonight or tomorrow.

 

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Okay. I have a single digit percentage of experience to probably all of you in regards to buying coins and maybe it is just a very weird coincidence that in the set I am building that the CERTIFIED labels that I have bought, the ones that are of the lesser quality are the ones that I paid the most for. the converse is also true. The best examples are one that I paid the least for. I am at 70 coins now in the 1909 VDB -

I concede that it could be that there are so many of these coins available that this is a anomaly of this particular coin, however my initial research is not reflective of that.

 

yeah.. I know.. one of the worst feelings I got was a collection of wheaties in one of those old green whitman albums I had bought for about $120 lousy pics, no details however it was written in away that I could tell a old guy was selling his collection. I got a message from him later saying. I hope you liked the set. I replied yes it was ok, no problems. IN retrospect, I think he was asking for feedback or he was sad, because when I finally did get around to taking a harder look, nearly all the cents were AU and MSBN!! Pretty sure if I broke it down and photographed properly it will easily bring 20 times what I paid. If I was a reseller, I would have done the right thing and sent a check. but yeah, I too feel really guilty with those home runs.

Oh yeah!!! I see that now.. for "argument" purposes this thread took the one statement about eBay vs TT and I posted data about that.

I am thrilled to check into HA more, I recently made my first purchases from there. I have 10 coins arriving any day now. I certainly am a fan of their images in spite of the diffused lighting they use on lincolns and how they light the reverses from the bottom of the coin.

I agree.... the example that Leadfoot asked me to check did not have any certified sold listings in AU over the last 90 days - THere is no argument from me that the rarities are not going to be found on eBay - you have to go to the Auction Houses or dealers for those. Then again, I didn't check the Auction Houses for that coin to back up what I just said.


See what I just did there?

 

You probably paid the "right" price for your stuff at the time you bought it. I bought gold at $743 only to sell those same coins at $385 at a later date. Coin prices fluctuate with demand and demand is inspired by how much descretionary income collectors have. During economic downside, prices tend to fall. Even dealers have to move enough inventory to cover expenses. When they don't make as much from the standing inventory, they must sell more of it. To sell more coins, they need to lower prices usually. It is a downward spiral that levels off with whatever the marketplace dictates. Sorry you lost some on the coins, but at least you had them to fall back on. I hope you return to work shortly and can weather this recession well.

gary

 

Real time example:

Here's a 'bay newp :devil:

$31

From what I can see HC and TT offer them also,, @roughly 100% more , and not many with comparable quality in my eye.

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/1929-D-LINCOLN-..._Individual&hash=item35aec9537e#ht_500wt_1156

I'll almost guarantee you that ANACS coin would never cross to PCGS or NGC as a 64

 

Your link is to a full RED coin, not a RB as this one. And with coin in hand, I'm quite comfortable that it would cross to a PCGS 64 and easily to a NGC 64...

http://www.teletrade.com/coins/lot.asp?auction=2867&lot=1063&imagetype=j2

 

OH , it's teletrade and not EBAY, makes no difference. I did realize it's a full RED., but a 64 is a 64 and IMHO that ANACS $31.00 coin would never cross to 64 IN either PCGS or NGC. Don't get me wrong, it's not a bad coin ,I think it's over-graded. One thing I find surprising though, is that there is that significant a difference between a RED and RB . For me , I never turn my nose up at a RB coin , even more so when there is that kind of spread .

 

The link to the TT auction is just to show what a pcgs RB can look like compared to this one (anacs), which I got from the 'bay..... This cent goes easily to a pcgs or ngc holder,, "easily". My only worry would be that they knock it to BN (which I also don't believe they would),, .. but dropped to a 63 ?,, no way. I suggest you take a look at a few pcgs/ngc ms63 rb's and then look at this coin again.... you'll generally find either weak strikes or some noise or chatter in the fields or the design,, of which this coin has neither.

 

Since I don't have the coin in hand , I'll have to take your word. But I can't hardly see PCGS or NGC calling that a BN either .

 

Why is it then that most people suggest using PCGS to get a higher grade for reselling the item. I cannot recall the thread, but it was mentioned that for coins you wanted to sell Not to send them to ANACS because the grade would likely be lower ?

Just asking

 

I think you are misinterpreting what's been shared here....

People mention PCGS as getting the highest prices -- for a coin graded the same in NGC or ANACS plastic.

However, for most coins, PCGS is more conservative in their grading than the others. If you send 10 coins to PCGS, then to NGC, then to ANACS, your grades will likely be LOWEST at PCGS, HIGHEST at ANACS (the new ANACS, that is), and somewhere in the MIDDLE will be NGC (in fact, NGC and PCGS grade to a very similar standard up to about MS 65, above that NGC is a bit more liberal).

BOTTOM LINE: For any given coin, PCGS slabs fetch the most value because they tend to have the most strict grading (i.e. you get more coin for a particular grade at PCGS).

All of the above IMO....Mike

 

Hi Gary, let's say this coin was submitted to PCGS , do you think it would bump grade to a MS 65 ? Absolutely not and I know you would agree . At best , submitted to either PCGS or NGC , I think this example would not cross to a 64 anything, but I could be wrong. To simply say if you wanted to sell coins graded, not to send them to ANACS for grading, because one would receive a lower grade is simply untrue. The coin tells the story . How many times have we all heard stories where a single coin gets re-submitted " raw " to competing Grading companies and receiving grades 1 or 2 grades of each other . To the coin at hand , but not in hand here , I believe it will not cross , and it makes no financial sense to send it to PCGS or NGC anyway . Again, the aspect that caught me completely off because I don't follow market trends on Wheat Ears , is the premium's being paid between a Red and Red-Brown example . In that light, for a $31.00 coin, with lots of eye-appeal , that's one heck of a buy. Leadfoot, gave a concise answer regarding Conservative grading between the Top 3-4 TPG's . Depending upon the issue/ Coin. ANACS offers some very good value's .

 

Some general and retrospective thoughts....

You can't grade coins accurately from photos.

You can't learn much about coin pricing from doing database queries -- particularly if those queries result in an apples-to-oranges comparisons (i.e. non-equivalent).

You can only effectively learn about coins by (a) seeing them in-hand, and (b) buying AND selling them.

The most dangerous type of collector is the intelligent one with some money who thinks he knows more than he does. Wisdom comes from recognizing that you DON'T know it all. However, that type of wisdom takes time -- typically much more time than it does to spend money on coins, and the vast majority of collectors (to include me!) learn this too late.

This is not a hit on anyone, but my own observations over many years of coin collecting -- shared in hopes that someone may learn from my mistakes without making the same. Reality and experience say I will not be effective, but that doesn't stop me from trying.

 

I suggested an 1880-s slabbed by PCGS in MS 65, not AU. I did this for a very good reason (or at least I thought it was).....

I'm not a Morgan collector, but if I had to guess, this (or the 1881-s) is the single most common date available in 65 and above grades (in fact, I'd wager these two coins have the largest pop in this grade among ANY US coins).

It's a $150ish coin.

No need to limit yourself to AU -- as you've found out this is not a common coin in AU...but it is in 65!

Do the search just like I suggested "1880-s Morgan PCGS MS 65".

Please do let us know what you find.

[edited to add -- it appears that the 1881-s is the most common. There were 40k examples in MS65 1881-s and 27k 1880-s in MS65 @ PCGS circa 2007.]

 

Glad you said that, I was thought the same way, was looking for someone that felt the same way. If someone states something without facts then it is an opinion, I like it when we have several opinions to make up my mind.

"Facts" can be used to prove a point also that are not always really true. There are excellent facts out there to show why the silver market will go up, there are also excellent facts as to why it will go down.

Since Doug was mentioned, can anyone name someone who has helped people more than him? He has helped me tremendously over the years. Do I always agree with everthing he writes? No, but I always highly value his opinion.

 

I'm sorry to detract from this thread, but did anyone appreciate this inadvertent pun? This is how phrases begin to change meaning over time, being seen and interpreted differently ; the term is as applicable to a medieval punishment device as it is to a modern day assertive forum 'post.' LOL

 

I did not compare coins. I did not use PL or DMPL coins. I only did heritage and ebay. I did not look at coins prices only. Found 24 coins sold on ebay - what is that for the last month? Not sure. So I only used 24 coins off of heritage. I tossed the high and low. I did not compare shipping(could be free on ebay, but no on HA) - average for ebay 140.39, for heritage 137.03. I did the numbers including the 2 tossed - so see the attached. If you go to the archives on heritage you can see on this coin it was the toning, but the same could possible be said for those on ebay. I also included the heritage 65* coins - I don't think there was one on ebay in the 24(I could be wrong).

So what does this tell us? Well it tells me they are both roughly the same give or take a few dollars. You would really need to grade the coins from the pictures - a,b,c. Then try to determine good buy versus bad buy. Toss out things like toning and where you know the buyer got extra because he used keywords like PL or DMPL with good pictures.

Now the coin is about $150 at a dealer if you throw out the toners they want hundreds if not thousands of dollars for. Funny - to do price only shopping with out looking at the coins.

OOOPS - ebay prices on left and heritage on right.

 

Mark, How could you possibly " toss " out the toning factor ?

 

Very nice comparison... did you check the sale date of the HC auctions.. They have a deep archive, so you need to ensure that your not including sales from 2002, etc...