Counterfiet Morgan!!

I am posting pictures of a counterfiet morgan dollar, and I am hoping a few of the CT people can show me things to look for in the future when buying Morgans.

 

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I am still new to the detection of countefiets so take what I say with a grain of salt. That being said the color and surface of the obverse don't look to me like a genuine coin, the eagles leg feathers look almost too pronounced the arrow feathers appear to be at an odd angle the reverse stars look almost too large and the whole design looks like it has the appearance of wear without any real signs of scratches like it was possibly cast from a vf or ef coin. just my two cents

 

Another thing I've noticed of many counterfeits coming out of China is the shortened denticles that do not correspond from obverse to reverse. You will note on the obverse that the denticles are much shorter between 12 & 3 o'clock, but they are normal length on the reverse between 3 & 6 o'clock. If this had been a (slightly) off-center strike, the denticles would be the same length on both sides. I've seen this many times, and it looks like the counterfeiter was using a duplicating lathe to produce the die, but did not have the coin perfectly centered for the transfer. That may also be why the entire texture of the surface of the coin doesn't look right.

One other thing you will note is the "A" of AMERICA touching the left wing of the eagle. This was modified in 1878 (I believe) so that the letter did not touch the wing. The telltale giveaway that an 1878 coin was used to copy everything but the date is the parallel arrow feather. This was changed to a slanted arrow feather for all Morgans struck after 1879.

Chris

 

The first tip-off to me on that particular coin, is the fact that there were no 1895 P Morgan business strike dollars minted.

 

Actually there were 12,000 Business Strikes minted but it is still an exceedingly rare coin. So when you see a raw 1895 Morgan Dollar you should suspect it may be counterfeit (or altered).

Like has already been said, the general appearance of the coin is suspect. The color is off. The surfaces are granular. The photos are not super detailed but I think I see numerous raised lumps all over the surfaces. There is a general lack of detail (see eagle's legs and feathers, denticles, etc.).

A magnet can be your best friend. If the coin is attracted to a magnet it is not 90% silver (or gold or copper) and is most likely going to be counterfeit (with some noted exceptions).

 

That one looks like an older fake.
'Modern' fakes look much better IMO.
I always tend to look the the date font.
Most of the time, the font, number position, and/or minor details on the numerals are 'off'.
They are getting better everyday though.

 

The surface also looks too "grainy" and the lowest points on the coin blend into the face of the coin. For example, the wings on the eagle, the hair

Why in the world would you purchase a raw 1895 P Morgan Dollar?

 

The first thing I noticed about this one is that the 5 is not the same style as the other three digits.

 

that's a poor counterfeit to boot IMHO from your photo .

 

If the die was out of alignment, wouldn't you see a corresponding offset between 6 o'clock and 9 o'clock on the same side?

Chris

 

I purchased it knowing it was a fake, I wanted to win a bet with my buddy that they were a lot of them out there, and that it would not say copy anywhere on the coin!!!!!

 

I hope you at least left the appropriate feedback?

 

Actually, to this date, the business strikes are not merely "exceedingly rare". Not a single one has been documented by a major grading company - only Proofs (some of them impaired/circulated) have been authenticated.

And the coin in this thread does not have the appearance of a Proof, even a circulated one.

 

I stand corrected. I was relying on my Red Book. Were the 12 bags of 1895 Business Strikes melted? I don't collect Silver Dollars and am not familiar with details such as this.

 

Mark,

Take a look at the top arrow feather.

Chris

 

Since none have surfaced, it is believed that they were all melted. Of course, it is possible that some are sitting around somewhere waiting to be discovered.

 

Why, Chris?

 

It's a parallel arrow feather from an 1878 die.

Chris