Coin Care Chemical

If some agent can bond and react with the metal why cannot some other agent break the bond?

 

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I will assume that we are talking chemical bonds. So far as most bonds with metals, the answer is yes. You can resmelt the metal.

 

In some cases, yes. In others, no.

Earlier, Thad played the "equilibrium" card. That applies only in cases where a chemical reaction is reversible, which is one of the "yes" cases you've mentioned. Commonly, the equilibrium state is shifted way in favor of either products or reactants i.e. one tends to be in excess concentration; one tends to rule. Either the reaction shifts toward completion or it is slow to get started.

I personally doubt that many, or any, of the verdigris-forming reactions are reversible.

 

Yes. They're cheap. No need for precision with lighter fluid.

 

Coin conservation does have a place in our hobby whereas coin cleaning does not. Conservation should be done by those who know what they're doing. EAC'ers have been conserving their coppers for time untold. Their proven methods have been passed down from one collector to another. I bought this piece out of an auction:





My image after crack out:






Here is the coin today:

 

Harshly cleaning a coin you mean, is not acceptable. Cleaning, conserving...whatever...semantics.
Harshly cleaning your new car's paint job would be unacceptable. Cleaning a dirty car properly...would be good. God forbid one would call a tomato a fruit, or call cleaning conserving.
Be careful...you wouldn't want to buy any copper coins cleaned with lighter fluid...cause it is instantly noticeable. Nobody's ever heard of it or tried it but, they know it's bad. They just know..cause they're really smart.

 

leeg - WOW! You did a fantastic job on the copper! It looks so much better now.

I'm with Doug here. That is a very old text. What is the source?

One mistake that completely stuck me was the improper use of xylene. First off, it will NOT remove verdigris. The physical action of rubbing the coin with a q-tip or a thorn may remove some, but chemically xylene is useless on verdigris. Also, as any collector knows, you do not want to run a q-tip across a coins surface to "apply" xylene (or for any other reason). It is far better to soak a coin in xylene so the surface debris is brought into solution without physical action. Nonetheless, it is pretty cool that they knew about the virtures of xylene on copper as a conservation agent!

One other thing that completely cracked me up was the warning about xylene causing "skin burns". NO NO and NO! LOL That is completely false. Xylene will not cause skin burns nor is it corrosive to the skin. It will dry your skin, defat it and (for some people) redness and irritation with prolonged contact....but NO burns.

 

I received the printed information from Rod Burress when I joined the EAC about five years ago. Not sure where Rod got the info from. I'm sure these methods have been used forever by EAC folks. I could look back in my Penny-Wise CD and find this info.

 

Here, I believe that the warning about xylene may not be technically correct, but is more than appropriate. I used to work with toluene (essentially the same as xylene in this aspect). Believe me, there was more than one person whose skin would crack and bleed with relatively short term exposure. Thank God, I was not one of them. It also depends on which part of the skin it is on. There are areas that you just do not want to get it on and I speak from very personal experiences in that respect. Now I am not saying that it will corrode your skin, but the results are not much better if you happen to be one of those that it bothers.

 

I really hate toluene. It's close to xylene, but xylene is a million times better to work with IMO.

 

Just curious and maybe I missed it above, but would these chemicals, any and all eventually also have an effect on flips and the windows in 2X2s? And maybe the glue in the folders?

 

I am not sure just which "chemicals" you are referring to. The solvents (toluene, xylene, acetone, naphtha, etc.) will absolutely dissolve or otherwise affect all of the above, but they should have evaporated before being put into anything. The oils/conditioners should have no affect on any holder - or at least in the quantities used for coins.

 

I hadn't tried this as any acetone treated coins of mine are dry before using the above. But I took a non-vinyl 2 X 2. Mylar or close , and a cardboard 2x2 with a mylar window, and put drops of acetone on the surfaces. After a short time, the acetone had evaporated and a wipe with a paper towel, and they looked new again, no visible effect. I only tried acetone, as that is what was close on hand. I keep the others in a chem locker in the garage.

HOWEVER! from my past experience, any TPG slabs , ( haven't tried the ones that are treated to prevent scratches, maybe they are more resistant), I have even had a tiny drop of acetone on one, marred ( frosted) the plastic.

Jim

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Thanks rim's, you answered my question as I was referring to the solvents mentioned. Sorry I was not more specific. We used Acetone for years where I work to clean Gravure printing heads used to print the imformation (scale, logo,etc.,)on our syringes but it was finally done away with after a major lawsuit involving a neuropathy case.(gloves were optional back then) In fact most of these solvents are dangerous unless handled with gloves and useing good ventilation. I have only used chemicals of any kind on badly dirty metal detector finds. Kind of old fashioned about leaving most in their original state.

 

In these solvent discussions, we have two dramatically different classes of compounds :

1. the group with xylene, toluene, and xylol. These are aromatics; they have a benzene ring plus a little more hangers-on. In my mind, they are more dangerous from a health standpoint. I have heard they have a higher rate of liver toxicity.
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2. the group with acetone and MEK. These are ketones. They are safer from a health standpoint.

 

I am not really sure where you are going with this. Yes, you are correct, although I do not find the differences to be that dramatic particularly for the small quantities we are talking about here. But, and this is a big BUT, Thad is saying that you should use both. Saying one is safer than the other makes no difference when you are using both.

Although, when you are talking about compatibility with other materials, I doubt that you could get any significant quantities of either without trying to do so, but in this case MEK/acetone are definitely better (i.e. more volatile).

 

Toxicity due to exposure.

I read a report indicating excessive exposure to m-xylene "produced clinical signs of toxicity such as excess salivation, hyperactivity, and convulsions"

I figured I would raise a flag, since many of us have those symptoms at coin shows and auctions !

heh

 

I only get those symtoms when a see that red head woman on HBO's True Blood!!!

 

Or one of those cable TV shows selling ultra-rare 2009 proof sets at "only" $399