Discussion Topic- Why are Carr "Fantasy Overstrikes" not considered Counterfeits?

well idea goto court and ask them then see what they say then ask the govt and so on till you get the answers you all want that way you will have a official answers not just options

seems you all are interested in something that was deemed legal years ago so have fun asking local, state and govt courts hope you get the answers you all seek

 

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It's been tried before, but how is that different than anything else in the world? You can sue for anything, doesnt mean it will go anywhere and if it does and you lose you will face large legal damages you owe in a nonsense lawsuit

 

I disagree as the term "deface "means any alterations done to a coin. And yes one could argue that love tokens, hobo nickels, cut out coins...etc.
However laws that protected money being defaced...were not enforced as no one was going to be jailed for putting their sweethearts name in a heart on a coin.
Years ago filming or photography of money was against the law...
The issue here is not his own designs...its him defacing US mint products or coping them...
And they arent marked as a copy or fake.

So intent....is something that the facts need be examined. If a kid takes 1 of grand pa's fake Carr dollars and decided to spend it....not knowing its FAKE is he guilty of passing counterfeit money?
Or is guilty of just plain stealing?
Each case is subject to the facts....and those facts should be the determination of said case.

To reply to the question if i own known counterfeit items are they not illigal unless I spend them?
Well the question answers is you know they are counterfeit...so thats what they are fake...and if spent then you taken it up a step.
I love old Ben Franklin notation right on the money "to counterfeit is death".
That may be a bit much.... however as a 10 year old in 1964 ,it was hard to believe that less than 100 year ago....stealing a horse would get you hung!
Laws change for the better or worst... and how and who interpreted them..... and as stated in other post the lines are drawn as to your interpertation of the law, and which side you believe to be right or wrong.....

 

Hope Mr. Carr wasn't tinkering with overstriking 1870 half dimes to create a "fantasy" 1870-S version back in the late 1970's.

 

I suppose there are a number of definitions of "deface":
1. To mar or spoil the appearance or surface of; disfigure.
2. To impair the usefulness, value, or influence of.
3. Obsolete To obliterate; destroy.

 

I am reminded of the movie "Harvey," where Jimmy Stewart plays this pleasant but slightly crazy gentleman named Dowd who travels through life with an invisible friend who happens to be a 6' 3-1/2" white rabbit named Harvey, who talks to him but not us. At one point a psychiatrist and a nurse track him down to his favorite bar, where Dowd is observed sitting in a booth having a pleasant conversation with the thin air. They ask the bartender "Is he alone," and the bartender, who considers Mr. Dowd to be a good customer because he always buys drinks for Harvey as well, replies "There's two schools of thought to that question."

Speaking as a former Senior Authenticator for the ANA, I do not consider Carr's legal tender design overstikes to be counterfeits, except for the 1964-D dollars because they were indeed struck. I believe that he made a mistake there. I have spoken with a former Denver Mint employee who was there when they were struck, and he told me that employees were allowed to buy them, only to have the Mint recall them the next day. The Mint of course denies this, but they have a habit of lying when it is convenient for them to do so.

I do believe that the other legal tender design overstrikes are "imitation numismatic items" as defined by the Hobby Protection Act of 1973 and subsequent revisions, and should be marked with the word "COPY" in accordance with that Act. The FTC is not inclined to bother enforcing the Act, so the question is moot.

 

We had a local coin shop here for over 60 years. It has closed about 3 years ago.
Sonny had a tray of contemporary counterfeit coins, with a red ink sign on an index card " not for sale"
Not that I was interested in purchasing, but asked Sonny why they aren't for sale.
He said Paddy dealers sell these openly at shows no problem.
But....he said under roof here its a different story...as I am a legitimate business and if I sold these to you or anyone else he said I could end up in jail.
Im not risking the chance of someone coming in ....buying one or two and then have a federal badge in my face.
He said at a show the chances of that happening are slim to none.
But at a store front business you're playing with fire.
If I accept money for that coin I am breaking federal law, as well state law. And I'm not going to risk my business on a $10 sale.

 

I have a cold cough-cough sneeze-sneeze on my screen can't see the question sorry.

 

A slight correction, that is incorrect.

Although ANA did examine the question and complaints, ANA is not one of the 3 Branches of Government, but I realizes there were and are times ANA thinks they are.

 

This is a bit of strawman, and is not remotely an equality of consideration of the question posed by Mr. Young.

 

What is your opinion on the pieces?

 

He stated the answer-altered coins.

Back to you, with the same question.

 

Can you point me to where -jeffB says "altered coins"?

My opinion? None of your business. Nosy.

 

This is amusing, of course they aren't counterfeit, but if anyone who wants to pass me one of his beautiful 1919 Peace Dollar fantasy pieces (or any of his other works) for a buck / face value, to try and "prove" these are counterfeit, I'm your huckleberry. Go nuts.

 

It was a little further down the thread:

The sides people take on this issue lead to some odd team rosters.

 

#13. The added bonus is he did not use the word 'to' or 'too' or 'two' so you are good to go.

The rest of your post...meh.

Don't Smith me, Bro.

 

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NANANANANA.....

I am old, don't Smith me, Bro.

 

I never stated I had an opinion, so you take your chances asking me for it.

 

Sigh...I don't care, one way or another.

Et Tu, Corgi? (had to get a 'tu' in there, to irritate you).

Where is my Latin dictionary? I can't find my Mr. Magoo themed glasses.

My mind wanders, take your chances responding to me.