Medieval Monday!

Regnum Visigothorum/ Septimania
Baetica
Chintilla 636-39
Toledo Mint

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

My only win from CNG's sale of the Ken Bressett collection.

Germany. Bavaria, Louis IV. 1317-1374. AR Pfennig (15mm, 1.37 g). Dortmund. Berghaus 22. Toned, weak in part. Good VF.

From the Ken Bressett Collection. Ex Spink 1971 @ $50.

 

Many thanks, @Orielensis, for your kind comments on mine of last week.
...And this week is a really cool range! Wow.
@Chris B, that's a terrific example (if a little on the late side) of the German imitations of Henry III's Irish pennies, with the facing portrait in the triangle. ...Rats, I can'ts find any pics of my Dublin cut half, but here's my less than stellar example of King John, with the same motif. Thanks to the English short cross pennies, continually issued in Henry II's name right up to his grandson and name sake, all that were issued in either John or his elder brother Richard I's names are the Irish pennies and halfpennies (John) and the deniers of Poitou and Aquitaine proper (Richard).

 

Alex Malloy attributed this coin to the Principality of Antioch, Late Anonymous, 1250 - 1268 . Three examples from the Slocum - Malloy collection were sold at FORUM about 12 years ago and described as the only three known . In 2018 , similar example appeared on the FAC discussion board . Plus my coin . I'm pretty sure there are more examples somewhere in private collections.
https://www.forumancientcoins.com/c...p?param=32267q00.jpg&vpar=1287&zpg=37388&fld=

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/c...p?param=32083q00.jpg&vpar=1287&zpg=37389&fld=

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/catalog/roman-and-greek-coins.asp?param=32084q00.jpg&vpar=1287&zpg=37390&fld=



And I’m not sure what coin it is :

 

My new space filler

 

@VD76, is that a gigliato (on the module of a French gros tournois, instead of the prototypical Venetian grosso) of Robert of Anjou, the earlier-mid-14th-century Capetian who wound up with the Kingdom of Naples?
As a space filler, that's Just Fine. I don't have one, but they're resonantly iconic. ...What immediately comes to mind as a prototype are the similar issues of the Lusignan kingdom of Cyprus, beginning early in the same century. --Of which I also don't have an example, but also cool. I like how the obverse motif evokes both the Armenian trams of Levon I (about a century earlier, on the smaller module of the original Venetian grossos --along with contemporaneous, Ayyubid dirhams), and royal seals from western Europe during the whole interval.
...Your Antiocene folles, especially the crazy-late ones, are terrific. I'm completely out of my league with Crusade-era stuff as late and correspondingly arcane as this, but you're making me sit up in my chair.

 

Chios under Genoa The Mahona AR Gigliato 1347 and later

 

Wow. ...Nope, no further comment at this time. I wouldn't just be deep in the weeds; I'd be poling through the swamp.

 

..well, to a novice medievalist like meself, i appreciate you saying what a coin is

 

What do you regulars think... do Byzantine coins count for this thread? I sorta feel like they get enough recognition among mainstream ancients collectors that this thread shouldn't really include them (except when related to an already posted coin), but maybe I'm being a snob.

I can pile on with a couple of things. First, another Vladislaus II Prague groschen, looks to be the same type as @Orielensis, though I'm not sure how to recognize the mint (were they all Kuttenberg?):


And to complement @VD76's nice gigliato, here's a denaro of the Maona/Mahona of Chios:

I was lucky to get this unidentified. Thought it looked cool and managed to figure out what it was. Here are my historical notes for those who are interested:

A maona (from the Arabic “mu‘āwanah” meaning 'mutual help’) was a company of shareholders who purchased a state’s right to a particular jurisdiction’s tax revenues; they cooperated in whatever way they saw fit to ensure the taxes were collected. These were the first modern western shareholding companies.

The Maona of Chios (also owning the tax rights to nearby Phocaea), formed in 1346 by purchasing the tax rights from Genoa, was the most notable of these companies, even issuing its own coinage. It was initially formed by the ship owners who retook the island in Genoa’s name, with the shares acting as payment for their services. The Maona was controlled by a Genoan family, the Giustiniani, who controlled the island until it fell to the Turks in 1566. Members of the Maona who were not Giustiniani by blood nevertheless adopted the family name.

The Maona continued to pay tribute to Genoa while gathering taxes in Chios and Phocaea, earning a tidy profit. In 1363, title to the island passed to John V Palaeologos and the arrangement continued.

 

And to add some flavor to my latest Byzantine post, I listened today to The History of Byzantium "The Empty Fleet." Khrusru II allegedly referred to Heraclius as his 'vile, imbecile slave." People had style then! Probably an ancient invention, but we can dream.

 

Very nice, @Severus Alexander.
...The whole question of Byzantines being medieval and/or ancient sets off a familiar set of synapses. I have to come back to the notion of such labels being terms of convenience, first and foremost, whether in numismatics or history more broadly. It's always best to start by seeing a given chronological spectrum in its richly ambiguous totality. 'Punctuating' it with specific dividing lines is necessarily a secondary part of the process.
You and @Orielensis's Prague groschens make me miss the one I got of John the Blind, who famously died at the Battle of Crecy in 1346. (The chronicler Froissart describes how his horse was led into battle by several grooms, and how he allegedly used one of those maces with a spiked ball on a chain, just swinging it around until it caught something.) ...This was early in my collecting of medievals, when I was still subject to occasional rent emergencies; the groschen was a casualty.
The story of the maona of Chios is fascinating. A textbook example of the economic and political sophistication of these folks, as of the 14th century.

 

...I so want it to be true!!!

 

I agree that Byzantine’s get plenty of love in other threads, but we’ve had Islamic and Chinese coins shared here, so why not Byzantines?

for funsies, here is a Northern Song coin I received in a lot which was minted around the time of the Battle of Hastings (this is assuming I attributed it properly…):
Northern Song China
Ying Zong, r. 1064-1067
AE Cash, 24.10 mm x 4.10 grams
Obv.: Zhi Ping yuan bao clockwise in seal script, feet of bao spread
Rev.: Bank
Ref.: Hartill 16.158

 

I don't think I have regular medieval coins, other than Byzantine .

Well...I do have some Sassanian and Nezak Huns, but they don't have adequate pictures.

 

@nerosmyfavorite68, here's another monkey wrench you can throw into the whole chronology thing. I've gradually come around to seeing the 6th c. CE as much in terms of something you could call 'late antiquity' as 'early medieval.' The Sasanians and later Huns (Nezak frankly goes sailing over my head) are textbook examples. But if you wanted to, you could start with the German tribes who took over the western Roman Empire --and proceeded to eloquently demonstrate how deeply invested they were in what was left of the Roman cultural legacy, as they found it on the ground.
Another good example are the Aksumites /Axumites, who, very much like the Sasanians, both witnessed and outlasted the later phases of the western Roman polity. ...Bouncing off of that, you could date the dividing line between 'Roman' and 'Byzantine' not only to the obvious coinage reform of Anastasius I, but to the beginning of Greek legends replacing Latin ones, from, what, the 7th or 8th centuries. I really gravitate toward being very mindful of the inherent limitations of labels (and of language more broadly), where this sort of thing is concerned.

 

I do have plenty of coins of the period 1000-1250. They just happen to be Byzantine or Byzantine offshoots.

Yes, there's quite a gray area of when medieval begins.

The Nezak Huns were vassals of the Sassanians somewhere along the line. I purchased a few from Dr. Fishman some yeras ago. Perhaps they are also known under an alternative name.

 

My question about posting Byzantine has nothing to do with the definition of "medieval," but only to do with the function of the thread. It seemed it had come to play the role of allowing fans of less popular medieval coins to post stuff, and I like that. As long as it continues to perform that function I have no problem with the occasional Byzantine showing up. And besides, the doyen of the thread has spoken!

A couple new things, even though it's Tuesday (see, I can bend the rules too):


Knights of Rhodes (Knights Hospitaller), Hélion of Villeneuve, 1319-1346, Gigliato. Hélion forbade his knights from pursuing the Dragon of Rhodes, but a certain Dieudonné de Gozon disobeyed this order and by specially training his dogs managed to vanquish the beast. Hélion punished Dieudonné for disobedience, but later relented and promoted him. Dieudonné became the next Grand Master. Meanwhile, the head of the "Dragon" was hung above one of the castle gates and remained there for several hundred years. Later visitors said that it was in fact a crocodile. (I thought this was a pretty cool story!)


Umayyad: temp. Hisham, dated 113 AH = 731/2. AR fourrée dirham.
When's the last time you saw a fourrée Umayyad dirham?

 

...@Severus Alexander, to your last question, Never!!! That's pretty great.
...And, Yeah, in either context (coins /history), everything we do, taxonomically, is that much after the fact; a correspondingly relaxed attitude can't not be a bad thing.
The gigliato and the story are both great. Nearest I got to seriously considering anything from the Knights of Rhodes was a denier, maybe of the preceding Grand Master, echoing the Genoese and Cypriot denaros and deniers. Now I'm wanting to see if I can find another one.

 

This was handy as it actually turned up today so couldn't be better for Medieval Monday.





Until I saw this coin on a German Auction site at the start of the month (Teutoburger ) I had never really given any thought to King Alexander III of Scotland.
Alexander III., 1249-1286
Penny o.J. (1280/1286), Berwick, Class 4.
From the limited research I have done. Alexander outwitted King Haakon of Norway by prolonging negotiations in respect of the Norwegian occupancy of the Islands when Haakon's fleet was in the Orkneys waiting to attack. Bad weather interceded as Alexander anticipated and the campaign failed with Haakon dying in the Orkneys bringing to an end his impressive rule of Norway of 46 years.
Alexander's three children predeceased him as did his wife and he died travelling on horseback in the dark riding to meet his new bride Queen Yolande de Dreux whom he hoped would give him an heir. His noblemen advised him not to venture out on dark night in terrible weather but he did, falling off his horse and breaking his neck.
My dilemma now is that this is the first Medieval or Ancient coin I have bought in a slab, albeit by accident not intent. I need to consider liberating it or leaving it as it is.