1794 Conder Token, Somerset, Bath DH 26, UNC

What is that a bribe

 

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In away I guess it is,but that will get a grade with out the marked clean on it

 

Here something token collectors may like?
http://www.coinnews.net/2010/02/12/...+CoinNewsnet+(CoinNews.net's+Numismatic+News)

 

Photography and dots

Some terrific photography on those tokens Larry!

When I first noticed the Bayly's "spot" posting, I thought perhaps one of my mysteries was solved, but I was thinking of a different spot! I also rushed off to find Catbert's frog.

Here's the snake side of my Middlesex 253. The spot under the tree appears to be an "inny" while the one within the snakes coils is raised.





EDITED: The image is mine (through a slab) from a time when I began experimenting with a new camera. Might be time to redo it! NGC 65BN

 

Wow, another anomaly

Yes, another oddity on yours, yarm. I like the way that we can relatively date tokens like Conders and Civil War Tokens from die chips, cracks, etc. I'm quite sure mine was struck before your example.

It's a terrific photo, too. Is it from Heritage Auctions, or did you take it? It looks to be MS-65 minimum, based on seeing one side only. The only thing that could be better would be demonstrating luster and color more vividly. There are tradeoffs in photography, to be sure, and I like to show the luster well when possible. Nothing shows luster better than a coin tilted toward a light source, or the use of axial lighting, imho. Of course, slabbed coins do not lend themselves to use of either of those techniques, due to the 'glare factor.'

BTW, I've heard about a terrific new resource for Conder Token collectors to be released soon, but am sworn to secrecy since I have been invited to preview the materials, and have only been studying them for a couple of days now.

 

Ah, that "frog" was a trick on my deteriorating eyes! Thanks for a great close up, Larry. No, I hadn't read that anywhere and you must now treat it as a vicious rumor. :keel:

My "spot" is more of a puncture and it is common in that area under the tree (not just my opinion, but dealer Bobbe's as well). Wonder why it is there?

 

The spot on my Bayly's is much more of a blob with an "inny" then the others posted here. Mine also does not have the dot in the middle of the snake that appears on Yarm's version.

The following were the seller's scans of my token - you have to actually search hard at 10x to find the 2 spots that show up so prominently in the scan.

 

Middlesex DH 319c •*Halls' Toucan

I took these photos today, of a recent arrival.

This is Middlesex DH 319c in Choice Uncirculated condition. It has some die polishing marks and a few other interesting details.

 

Very nice Larry! :hail:

 

Larry, your beautiful, highend tokens have inspired me...here's the latest addition to my collection...

 

Wow, that's a nice high-grade example of Somerset, Bath DH 26, yakpoo. I'd estimate that it is AU-UNC, and the weakness at the right-hand side of the tree (and lettering from 1:00 to 4:00) on its reverse in the bottom photo tells me that there is less wear than some might imagine. The slight weakness in the center of the tree is typical and not an indication of wear at all. Though the images could be better, it appears to have a good deal of mint red remaining. Better photos might assure me of its UNC status, and I'd love to see the quality of the mint red in more detail. : )

Congrats on acquiring a very nice example and thanks for sharing it here.

BTW, I hope you've seen the Numismatography thread I started, since you had asked about photography of coins, as have other members. There are quite a few nice images posted on that thread and some information about how some of us photograph our coins, tokens, and medals. I'd rate the quality of these nice images on a scale of 1 to 10 at about 8. Very nice work. : )

 

NO!! I hadn't seen your photography thread, but I'll be on it! :bow:

The pictures of this coin are from the auction I won. I have no idea of mintages or value, but I really like many of these designs and hope to learn/collect much more. This coin is an NGC MS65RB. I likely overpaid, but usually only consider a coin's value "to me" when making a bid. With that said, I would be interested in your opinion of it's current price.

 

Wow

Based on seller's images, I'd have difficulty assigning grade of MS-65, but it might be fully up to the grade assigned. I'm now hoping to see photos that you take of it. One good indicator is the set of two horizontal lines at the top of the gatepost on the left and yours are about as good as I've seen. I had noticed that outstanding feature. But other indicators including the strike would enter into my personal grade assessment, wherever that ends up. : )

I would believe it is surely uncirculated if NGC assigned such a fantastic Gem grade. : )

Value for an MS-65 (Gem) would be $175-200 or more I would estimate, though the issue is Common, meaning up to a couple of thousand were struck. My UNC example cost $135 and I'd estimate its exact grade at MS-63.

If a plain-edged halfpenny token it would be considered Common, but value could be higher if of variety 26a,b,c,or d, which are all rated RR, meaning that fewer than 30 were struck. You may need to check its edge lettering or lack of lettering to be sure of its variety.

If encapsulated in a slab with the new Edge-View feature, seeing the edge should be much easier than if housed in an old-style slab. I am guessing it's in the mail and will take some time before you can know its variety beyond any doubt. If you'll tell me the characteristics of its edge, I will be able to tell you its variety for sure. : )

 

Nope...this is a plain edge variety. If you click on the link in my last post, you can see the slab and the attribution...and what I paid :crying:.

Still, I really like the coin (I have a couple of lower grade examples) and wanted one in a high grade...the detail of the Cedar tree is really spectacular!

I don't have any reference materials for Conder Tokens and had no idea that different varities exist. This is an area of collecting I would like to learn more about. I really appreciate your help. :bow:

 

Thanks, yakpoo, I had not noticed the link or the grade you provided. Sorry. The item listing plainly states that the token has a plain edge, so it is a Bath 26.

Well, the 85% red would be amazing, but I'd have to see better photos to agree with that assessment and that what the seller was seeing was actually 'mint red.' Still, any nice NGS MS-65 might easily be worth the amount you spent.

 

Great pick.That only the 2nd one like that I have seen

 

T. Hall

More on Thomas Hall (including his toucan and Mrs. Newsham) at "Victorian Taxidermy!"



http://www.taxidermy4cash.com/Victorian.html

There are writeups accompanying each of Hall's pieces in R.C. Bell's
"Tradesmen's Tickets and Private Tokens".

 

Thanks, yarm...

I've read portions and bookmarked the article. Questions remain for me as to Mrs. Newsham's exact role, and she and Jeffery Dunstan may have served as barkers outside to attract customers, though they may have also been part of a 'show.' I believe the main attraction inside was stuffed animals and birds.

I'm still open to further updates. : )

 

Wow.

 

If anyone here is interested in owning a rare (mintage 72!) 1799 Church and Castle Tamworth half-penny token, PM me and I'll send you a link with an article and a picture of the token concerned...