Colombia (Spanish Colonial): gold 8-escudos of Charles IV, 1808-NR JJ

Discussion in 'World Coins' started by lordmarcovan, Feb 21, 2022.

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How interesting/appealing do you find this coin, whether or not you're an expert? (1=worst, 10=best)

  1. 10

    8 vote(s)
    32.0%

  2. 9

    11 vote(s)
    44.0%

  3. 8

    2 vote(s)
    8.0%

  4. 7

    1 vote(s)
    4.0%

  5. 6

    3 vote(s)
    12.0%

  6. 5

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%

  7. 4

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%

  8. 3

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%

  9. 2

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%

  10. 1

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan 48-year collector Moderator

    Colombia (Spanish Colonial): gold 8-escudos of Charles IV, 1808-NR JJ
    01-Colombia-8e-frame.png
    Obverse: CAROL•IIII•D•G• HISP•ET IND•R•, armored bust of Charles IV right.
    Reverse: IN•UTROQ•FELIX• •AUSPICE•DEO. Denomination (8 S) flanking crowned arms inside chain holding the Order of the Golden Fleece. •NR• mintmark and     •J•J• mintmaster initials below. Double dot D:G variety.
    Issuer: Charles IV, King of Spain (1788-1808). Struck at the Casa de Moneda in Bogotá, Nueva Reina de Granada (now Colombia), under Spanish rule.
    Specifications: 27.06 g, .875 fine gold, .7615 oz AGW, 37 mm.
    Grade: PCGS AU58, cert #38916730.
    Reference: Numista-22976, KM-62.1, Restrepo 97.40a (per PCGS).
    Provenance: ex-Michael Swoveland, dba WNC Coins, LLC, 21 Feb 2022.
    Notes: The largest of the circulating Spanish Colonial gold coins at the peak of their empire, the 8-escudos piece was a mainstay of world trade during the colonial era and the European settlement of the Americas. The word escudo means "shield".
    Comments: These coins were also a big part of the booty seized by buccaneers during the "Golden Age of Piracy", though this particular example postdates that era and was struck shortly before the wars of independence fought by the Spanish colonies in the Americas. Even without its impressive colonial history and aesthetic appeal, this is a fairly massive piece of gold. It has a larger diameter than a US double eagle, though not quite as much gold content as the later American coin.

    02-Colombia-8e-TrueView-800p.jpg

    03-Colombia-8e-black.png

    04-Colombia-8e-gradient.png

    05-Colombia-8e-white.png

    06-Colombia-8e-obv.png

    07-Colombia-8e-obv.png

    08-Colombia-8e-slab.png

    200000S
     
    lordmarcovan, Feb 21, 2022
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  3. Chris B

    Chris B Supporter! Supporter

    Very nice @lordmarcovan

    I have one as well. This one is not my photo...but that should be obvious. Mine is only a 53.

    Col179405.jpg
     
    Chris B, Feb 21, 2022
    #2 + Quote Reply
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  4. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan 48-year collector Moderator

    Lovely. You have some nice toning going on there.

    Speaking of which, I sold my 1-escudo, mostly because it was Charles IV also, and essentially a smaller version of the same design (and I'm getting ready to go back to a fixed-quantity "Box of _" (100) collection, so I don't need duplication. But it was a nicely toned piece. I wish my new 8- had toning as nice as the 1- did!

    [​IMG]

    PS- I like your CollecOnline sigline link, and the fact that you've set up there, as I now have.
     
    lordmarcovan, Feb 21, 2022
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  5. johnmilton

    johnmilton Well-Known Member

    I voted 6, which is lowest so far. I have specialized in U.S., British and Imperial Roman coins plus some related tokens and medals. A piece like this was probably used in the U.S. before the Civil War because we had a coin shortage at that time. Otherwise, it's not something that I add to my collection.
     
    johnmilton, Feb 21, 2022
    #4 + Quote Reply
  6. Bardolph

    Bardolph Active Member

    NR = Nuevo Reino de Granada, modern day Bogotá, JJ =Juan Rodríguez Uzquiano and Juan José Truxillo y Mutienx, mint master and assayer from 1780 to 1789
     
    Bardolph, Feb 21, 2022
    #5 + Quote Reply
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  7. panzerman

    panzerman Well-Known Member

    Beautifull coins Lordmarcovan:)

    Here is one of mine from Popayan Mint/ Carlos III 6f691ccaf98b965ff57c4895d9d429d1.jpg
     
    panzerman, Feb 21, 2022
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  8. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan 48-year collector Moderator

    Thank you. I was wondering who that "JJ" mintmaster was. Turns out it's two J-name guys, then? Neat. But what about those dates?
     
    lordmarcovan, Feb 21, 2022
    #7 + Quote Reply
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  9. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan 48-year collector Moderator

    What say ye about the $10 Indian that came in the same shipment?

    I've got a Gothic florin on the way, too, speaking of British.

    PCGS AU50. A bit of chatter in the fields, which I feel is compensated for by the toning, which I quite like.

    [​IMG]
     
    lordmarcovan, Feb 21, 2022
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  10. spirityoda

    spirityoda Coin Junky

    Wow. Now you got my attention. lol. I have wanted 1 of these, but they get pricey in high grades.
     
    spirityoda, Feb 21, 2022
    #9 + Quote Reply
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  11. Mountain Man

    Mountain Man Well-Known Member

    To me, your poll isn't valid as I find the coin very appealing, but more because I'm so conditioned to seeing American coins that the different elements of design draw my attention in. Just my opinion.
    This is one reason I like buying bulk world coins and going through them.
     
    Mountain Man, Feb 21, 2022
    #10 + Quote Reply
  12. WashQuartJesse

    WashQuartJesse Member Supporter

    I like it and find it interesting!

    Edit: My apologies. I had very erroneously posted a Potasi-Bolivia reference to this Colombia coin while suggesting "Cross had identified these as being very relevant to Colonial Canada (Charlton). He specifically notes Charles IV 1788-1808, the "denomination", and Potosi."
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2022
    WashQuartJesse, Feb 21, 2022
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  13. robinjojo

    robinjojo Well-Known Member

    That's an excellent coin! Nice toning and strike. I've seen so many of these large gold coins harshly cleaned or ex-jewelry.

    My coin has some mileage on its meter.

    26.8 grams

    D-Camera Colombia 8 escudos Chas IV Bogota 1810JF 26.8g KM 66.1 2-22-22.jpg
     
    robinjojo, Feb 22, 2022
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  14. robinjojo

    robinjojo Well-Known Member

    "JJ" are the initials for two assayers at the Bogota Mint.

    According to Krause they are Juan Jose Truxillo y Mutiienx, and Josef Antonio Rodriguez y Uzguiano.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2022
    robinjojo, Feb 22, 2022
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  15. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan 48-year collector Moderator

    Those polls are extremely unscientific and just for fun. It’s just something I do for the coins in my collection that get a full writeup. Which I’m hoping will be all of them… someday. Might never happen.
     
    lordmarcovan, Feb 22, 2022
    #14 + Quote Reply
  16. WashQuartJesse

    WashQuartJesse Member Supporter

    Robinjojo, Your post alerted me to my error. Thank you.
     
    WashQuartJesse, Feb 23, 2022
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  17. Bardolph

    Bardolph Active Member

    Sorry, I must have been daydreaming. Those dates for the two Js were during the reign of Carlos III. They carried on their good work from 1789 - when the news of the death of Carlos III in 1788 reached Colombia - up to 1809 under Carlos IIII.
     
    Bardolph, Feb 23, 2022
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  18. Ronald J Dawley

    Ronald J Dawley Member

    Beautiful coin, alas, I don't have any of those.
     
    Ronald J Dawley, Feb 23, 2022
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  19. longshot

    longshot Enthusiast Supporter

    Really neat coin. Gold doesn't seem to draw me in like it does some people, (or at least seldom enough bang for the buck), but I would love to own a piece that looks like that.
     
    longshot, Feb 23, 2022
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