I've been collecting coins for four years, and I still classify myself as a beginner, mainly because I still find it very difficult to grade coins. My true passion is collecting raw coins, but after learning that I had bought lots of cleaned, overgraded junk on Ebay and from mail order dealers, I was forced to grudgingly accept buying PCGS slabbed coins out of necessity. I don't know that there will ever come a day when I know enough about coins (re: grading them) to pursue my dream of collecting raw coins stored in flips. In reflecting recently, I wonder if I have made the proverbial bargain with the devil by adopting slab and sticker collecting: they provide me with some security, but at the price of pursuing a '*******ized' way of collecting that I enjoy much less (for me, there is simply no comparison between holding a coin in a staple or plastic flip (or even by the rims) and holding a coin entombed in plastic). The former gives me a unique feeling of satisfaction and wonder, whereas the latter makes the coin seem so distant and impersonal. Do any other inexperienced collectors hate slabs, but resign themselves to collecting them because of winding up with a collection that is cleaned, overgraded, junk? Does anyone feel more like a slab and sticker collector than a coin collector?Thanks for sharing.
I think slab vs raw depends on what and where you're buying. If you are buying trade dollars or more expensive coins especially online then you would be wise to buy them slabbed. If you are buying common date ho hum morgans you can find many ms raw coins at any show or coin shop. Use your slabbed coins to help you grade.
If you can't discern between cleaned/uncleaned and you hate the impersonality of slabs... Buy graded coins and crack them out so you get to observe the coin better and you know you are not buying junk.
Are you collecting for security or for fun. Slabs are great when it comes to rare or valuable coins, but seriously, how often do we buy such coins? If you use the slab as a crutch you'll never learn to grade for yourself. Buy some books and do some reading. Guy~
I think you need some practice at cracking out coins from slabs. Try it on some cheaper coins first until you get the knack of it. Most people just bang on the edge of the slab with a hammer (gently) multiple times until the slab begins to fall apart. I've also known people to put it in a vice to crack it. I use a hammer with the slab wrapped in a cloth so that it softens the blow and prevents plastic pieces from flying around. Or, you can practice grading and get better yourself. Go to a lot of coin shows and look at a lot of coins. Forget buying from the full double page color ads in coin magazines. Develop a relationship with a dealer, local or mail order. That's really the fun of collecting. As for me, I collect both raw and slabbed. I appreciate both. With a slab, it's also protected within its own holder, so that's another way of looking at it. I like collecting uncirculated 64 and 65 Morgans slabbed. But for circulated collector coins, like buffalo nickels and bust halves, and also AU Morgans, I like to collect raw. So it just depends what you're comfortable doing. The more you learn, the better you'll get and enjoy coins more.
While learning to grade I agree with your strategy. Others may not like it, but learning to grade is not so easy on some coins. So, I would say continue to collect coins in slabs - just make sure you think the coin in the slab meets that grade. But always look at as many coins as possible and try to learn grading. One day you will probably be comfortable buying raw coins, but stick with your current strategy until you have this comfort. I said this in another thread, but I find it thrilling to find a nice raw coin and get it graded at (or near) what I think it is. I do not do this with every coin I get, but some coins I will get slabbed. I have 10 or 15 I will try this year. Plus - some coins are very hard to tell if they are cleaned(especially in pictures). I know it takes lots of practise and patience and looking at coins, but it will take years to perfect it - plus I like collecting now. So I will make mistakes with some of my raw coins, but hopefully I keep learning. Do the slabs make the coin impersonal??? Not to me - you fondle that raw coin too much, you could put wear on it, or drool on it or maybe even drop it. The slab does offer some protection and I like that. I have several sets going - some raw and some graded. Usually the higher graded stuff is(or will be) slabbed. This is only my preference and my opinion.
Buying raw coins on Ebay, vs. buying raw coins from reputable dealers say at a show often leads to different results. There are also disreputable show dealers, so beware. There is nothing inherently wrong with buying raw. However, novices, looking for bargains often get the shaft when they go to buy. Slabs offer only so much protection in this time of fake slabs and so many low end for the grade coins in holders. Novices buying high dollar value slabbed coins will tend to lose more money than novices buying lower value raw coins. The slab offers only so much protection. As always, best to collect what a person likes and enjoy the hobby. If a person doesn't enjoy slabs don't buy them. If that means raw, then go that route, but don't keep falling into the same pits over and over again. Learn the basics of grading, learn which sellers are reputable. Unfortunately, that would be a small group on the 'bay, and not all that large a group at shows either. Sure a person is almost sure to pay a lot more for coins at the same "stated" grade from these better tier of sellers. That would be true for both raw coins and slabbed coins. However, like I said novices looking for bargain coins often will get the shaft instead. One suggestion is to seek out dealers recommended by much more experienced collectors.
As a collector of Military Payment Certificates for about 20 Years, I to Started collecting "Raw" notes but came to the realization in a short time That TPG was the best way to grow my hobby, There,s to many if,s and,s And But,s in raw notes plus the fakes and phonies, It just make sense to Go TPG
Grading coins is an art developed over time. I learned as a child, "cutting my teeth" on inexpensive coins, so the lessons learned weren't too costly, looking back. Maybe others can weigh in on what I believe and that is most coins have been cleaned at one time or another (especially if they're frosty white Morgans), it's simply impossible for a coin not to tarnish, unless it's sealed right from the mint. So, the question should be, how was the coin cleaned, properly affecting the surfaces very little or with Ajax leaving scour lines all over it, destroying it's appeal?
I am not a fan of graded coins. I have only two. My suggestion, if you are that worried about what grades other people give the coins, is to buy graded coins in various grades. And study them until you know every detail about the coins. Also include coins that PCGS labels genuine and whatever term NGC uses as well, if you wish. After you've spent lots of time studying the coins, in theory then you will know what makes the coins grade that way they do and then, you've taught yourself grading. I don't really care much about grades, and numerical grades don't mean a thing to me...the only thing that matters, to me, is weather or not I like the coin.
The ANA offers Summer Seminars on Coin Grading. Knowledge is power. http://www.money.org/Content/NavigationMenu/NumismaticEvents/SummerSeminar/default.htm
Both slabs and raw coins have their advantages and disadvantages. I am trying to complete a type set. They will be all slabbed. Expensive? You bet. But by buying slabbed coins, I have somewhat of a safety net when it comes time to re-sell my coins. I know that they are authentic, and the grade that is stated on the holder. These grading services make mistakes. That's why don't blindly trust the grade that the service puts on the coin. I grade it myself before I purchase it.
Give your self a gift, learn to grade and tell cleaned coins Give your self a gift, learn to grade and tell cleaned coins - this is your answer. I hate slabs and break evey one I find if I want the coin for me but your answer is learn to grade or buy plastic.
If you are buying online you should buy certified coins for the most part. It is hard to tell a "lightly cleaned" coin online. That lightly cleaned thing and the naturally retoned after light cleaning is really common with older coins and it is tricky.
Unfortunately for you, if you like original coins, knowledge is key. The grading companies love cleaning nice original dark surfaces off of coins to make them "marketable." I guarantee you that if you sent them a dark brown seated half dollar with dirt on it that was a stunning 50 coin, it would come back in a 53 slab with all of the gunk removed. Nearly all gold dollars I have seen in slabs have been dipped (hairlines.) I have also seen dipped IHCs in 65 RB slabs. Slabs do not protect you from cleaned coins, knowledge does.
Yes! It,s very hard to tell if a coin has been cleaned with out examining It up close, Pics are nice but dont tell the whole story!:desk:
Only if you blindly accept what is on the label. If you don't continue to learn how to grade on your own you will never know if the coins in your slabs are correctly graded or if you have been buying low end or overgraded stuff. So you still have to learn how to grade on your own, and if you can do that why pay extra for slabs?
As an inexperienced collector myself, I hear ya, and I share your exact reasons for finding slabs unappealing. But, I have not resigned myself to collecting slabs, and neither should you if you prefer raw. Just remember that grading is not rocket science, it's more of an art form. Since I won't be buying really expensive pieces on my budget, I've bought some books and will to learn how to buy raw without getting burned.
A lot of food for thought. Thank you to all for sharing your insights and experiences. I will spend much time re-reading this thread. There's a lot to process (and here I was worried before that I would get few replies CT is a great resource because of all of the knowledge and experience that members share. You just have to be willing to search a bit and read. Thanks again
