Hi all! I know discussions are already on Forvm Ancient Coins and r/AncientCoins, but there isn't a thread here yet, so I'm posting one in case people aren't active on the other sites The new Katz auction has many suspected fake coins listed as genuine, including die matches to other coin in the same sale. None of these are marked as forgeries As an antoninianus collector, I went straight to their Imperial section to see what they had to offer. If I were looking to buy fakes, I would not be disappointed. Most of them have weird portrait styles - and even some common coins look like forgeries. Salonina: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964306 Laelianus: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964311 Marius: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964310 Another Marius: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964312 Quintillus: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964314 Aurelian & Vabalathus: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964316 Tetricus II (Seriously, genuine ones are like £10) https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964318 Probus: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964324 Numerian: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964332 Carinus (Rare obverse legend) https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964334 Carausius: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964338 There are also a couple of die matches of antoninianii, matched with coins IN THE SAME SALE Probus: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964326 https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964327 https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964330 (Looking at the coin, I wouldn't have said it was a fake. However, the fact that there are THREE of them indicates otherwise) Carausius: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964336 https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964337 Allectus: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964339 https://www.biddr.com/auctions/katz/browse?a=1814&l=1964340 I only checked the antoninianii, so this is just scratching the surface How are they getting away with this? If anyone from Biddr is reading this, can something be done about this? Apparently, according to Reddit, OP says that, in the past when Katz has been accused of selling fakes, they have added 'Old Collector's Copy' to the description. I suspect they will have to add that to a lot of their listings... On Forvm Ancient Coins, there is a seven (!) part discussion about these fakes here: https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?board=9.0 And the Reddit post is here: https://www.reddit.com/r/AncientCoi..._of_suspected_fakes_on_upcoming_katz_auction/
I know they're fakes, but I'd almost be tempted to buy some as curiosities lol - especially the Tetricus and Salonina
There are some problematic Greek coins as well. Unfortunately I don’t have time to post today but I think everyone gets the message to stay away!
What bothers me the most is that I can't spot any fakes in this topic. I am not an experienced collector but I am starting to wonder why I can't see the clear signs. What bothers me also is that it looks there is an industry of forgeries of cheap coins. Beats me. And of course I am wondering if I don't have some fakes in my collection - I don't have expensive coins but it would be disturbing.
All is not lost. There must be dozens of ancient coin collectors who have not yet become international auction houses.
“Know the coin or know the seller.” In time, you will be able to spot a lot of fakes. It won’t come quickly, though.
Usually biddr takes actions, once they are informed. Problem is that many of those "new" auction houses either are not willing or are not capable of hiring experienced numismatists. Over here in Germany experienced stamp-auction companies are getting into numismatics as stamps don´t sell any more. This can lead to two scenarios: 1. You get auctions loaded with forgeries (not only ancients) 2. You see auctions with marvellous old collection offered at ridiculous prices and top dealers buying at ridicilous prices The market is changing
In the USA, I get the feeling that there are virtually no devpted stamp collectors anymore (as opposed to people who occasionally buy new US stamp issues, and/or save envelopes they receive with foreign stamps on them) between the ages of 10 and 75. My father, who collected stamps in his childhood in the 1920s and early 1930s, tried to make a stamp collector out of me when I was 7. I lasted a couple of years, but world coins had lured me away by the time I was 10, and fell in love with British coins on a vacation to the Bahamas.
Harry, Thanks for posting ! These coins are pretty scary stuff . It looks like nothing is beyond the reach of these avaricious scumbags . No doubt many of these fakes will be gobbled up by collectors who aren't members of CT, & would never suspect that such common coins could be counterfeited . What will counterfeiters go after next, Lincoln Memorial pennies ?
I spotted the fakes too. This is very disappointing. Katz is great for medieval Russian coins, but their ability to deal with ancients is abysmal if they can't identify these coins as modern forgeries.
Lansky is another shop which knowingly sells fakes. They sold a fake Baletium coin for EUR 8000. When I called them on it, they went ahead and sold it anyway. http://auctions2.live-bidder.com/clients/lansky/en/sale/showLot/1083/38 There were other fakes in that auction, which happened last summer, including a few Tarentum nomoi. There were probably many more outside my area of expertise which I would have been less confident about condemning. This gets back to the point made earlier about if you know the seller, you can trust the coin. I'm more than a little disappointed that some of these auction houses and dealers are moving to the dark side to make a quick buck (or are just too overwhelmed to properly screen what they're selling).
What I'd really love to see is a "no holds barred" review of all auction houses and sellers. Each one would have a score, and each fake found in a listing would ding it, and each uncovered fake not withdrawn would affect it even more. Many know of the list of known Ebay scammers, though I avoid EBay altogether, but things are fuzzier with auction houses and other sellers. It would be nice to make information like this available for general use. Companies like Katz and Lansky are major threats to our hobby.