1981P Lincoln - Improper alloy mix (edit: roller marks)

Found this while going back through my penny jar a second time. I'm actually assuming this is an improper alloy mix - it's not as cool as err-ref's examples, but seems to have similar striations. Let me know if this is not the case.

So, how common is an alloy mix error? I'm trying to decide if this goes into the 'found a good error' folder or the 'just looks cool' folder.

Thanks for any opinions

 

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Coool Jar !! Nice specimen .

 

Isn't that what they call a Woodie? Yes it is an improper alloy.

Here is another CT thread featuring a Woody!

https://www.cointalk.com/threads/for-all-the-woodie-fans-out-there.377980/#post-7320105

 

Nice! That 1955 S is gorgeous.

 

I believe that a Woodie is actually now called an improper alloy mix as I recall .

 

Roller marks, IMO. Caused by dirty rollers during the stripping process, not an alloy issue. Notice how the lines of the are basically parallel with almost no thickness variation within each line.

Improperly mixed alloys will also show elongated areas due to rolling, but the size and shape will vary because the size/ shape of the inhomogeneous region is random. Compare this to some of the goodies found on early Lincolns and you'll see the difference.

Roller marks like this show up regularly on copper cents from the early 80s

 

Thanks for the info @Oldhoopster. From what I'm reading roller marks are surface area only and are akin to toning changes - they can be worn off unlike alloy mix issues.

Into the 'looks cool' folder, it is.

 

Another variable is the striking pressure, as a proper strike will usually obliterate these. They're found on virtually every series of coin. Also note, your cent is copper. The other 80's cents that show this are the other copper ones, the 80s and 82s. 70s cents are somewhat infamous for these. I've not seen it on 82 and up zinc cents.

 

My dad has one like this in his collection labeled as a roller coin. I only ever knew them as a woodie. I just thought It was the tech term and didn't realize they were 2 separate events.

 

error-ref had a comment about roller marks but no examples. I found examples elsewhere, though and yup, I can see the difference. Still cool looking and a keeper, though. And I'm glad I found an 81 in good enough condition that the marks still remain.

And I'm glad quality members of CT are willing to spend their time assisting - thank you all

 

The lines are to narrow to be anything other that roller marks. Nice example.

 

it's called a wood grain penny due to improper alloy mix nothing more or nothing less

 

Nice find for a second go-around. I'd put it in the "cool" folder also.

 

I believe these would be considered improper metal mix:

 

Nice. I see how you have streaks that start and then taper off (even blobs), instead of being exact all the way through the coin. Nice examples, thanks!

 

nice wheats for those dates!

 

QUOTE="CygnusCC, post: 7621723, member: 120299"]Found this while going back through my penny jar a second time. I'm actually assuming this is an improper alloy mix - it's not as cool as err-ref's examples, but seems to have similar striations. Let me know if this is not the case.

So, how common is an alloy mix error? I'm trying to decide if this goes into the 'found a good error' folder or the 'just looks cool' folder.

Thanks for any opinions

View attachment 1311610
View attachment 1311611 [/QUOTE]
BEAUTIFUL WOODGRAIN

 

Hard to explain but I'll give it a go. I believe the 1981 is roller lines. all improper alloy "woodys" I've seen, the lines just aren't so perpendicular and at some point get blotchy from the improper alloy being spread out when rolled. looking like wood grains. it's not uniform, and rarely is from obverse to reverse although the lines go in the same direction on a coin flip, the blotchiness streaks and spreads in the direction of the sheet rolling.

Roller lines stay uniform and straight and perpendicular to each other because it happens during rolling and not before it's scratching, it's the same direction on obverse and reverse on a coin flip as well, but there's no streaking or "flow" to it, just lines.

-If someone were crazy enough to clean a woody to remove the toning, all of the metal would be the same color again as it was in mint state and fresh, and then it would re-tone at different speeds in the same places again due to the metal not being alloyed well.

-Roller lines if you cleaned it and stripped off the toning, the lines would still be there in the surface of the coin. they are visible from day one, those lines are basically catching dirt with time and the lows getting darker than the highs of the scratches in the planchet.

only examples I have really of either so sorry if I posted this stuff a couple times a year and you've seen it before and bored of these pictures. LOL

Woody:


Roller Lines:



My opinion, everything on this page so far is a woody, except the 1981 and the 2005 I just posted. there's a clear visual difference between the two that gives them away although it's impossible to tell the secret the woody is hiding if it's MS Red. Roller lines are apparent even when it's mint fresh.

 

Thanks @John Burgess, that sounds consistent with what I've been reading. Also it seems, at least as far as US copper pennies go, the improper alloy mixes have been from before the mid-1900's and the roller lines have been from the 1970's on. I'll keep that in mind for future hunting.

As a side note, now that I've noticed the roller lines on that 81, a large portion of zincoln coins I've seen seem to have those striations you show on your 2005. Not multicolored, but ridges - I was starting to think that was part of the business strike background and was an intentionally created relief element in the field. Either that or some weird die polishing side effect.

Edit: added a few examples I just now snapped in the attachments. Apologies to all for not making them full screen but I didn't want to take up the space in this thread for them (also it makes it easier to compare line directions when you flip through them). I wonder if there's something about the thin layer of copper that makes it more prone to this type of distortion...

 

That 1915 is one to kill for. Very nice. The detail in this series was the best back then.

Here's one to ponder. Particularly on the obverse, look at the lines going one way, and the waviness, cutting across, and going the other way. Funny how these turn out. These lines actually could be from the rollers, they're just a little indistinct. A lot of "woodies" are "rollers," too, I think. At least to a degree, the rollers helped them out some.