Another burglary . . . this time it was Barry Stuppler's shop.

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There should be 1 major website where you can look up to see if the coin you are considering buying (dealer or customer) has been reported as stolen.

 

Part of what I mentioned earlier, I learned here:

Pawn Stars: BIBLICAL COIN WITH A SECRET PAST (Season 7) | History - YouTube

Start at around 3:50 for the theft part.

 

Hi

I already quoted the exact statute that requires stolen property to be returned to the original owner, and I know this to be the case both as a matter of law and as a matter of international treaty. There is no left or right on this. However, you can't just seize it. You need to go to court and have the sheriff get it for you upon the court order. And the law for antiquities and cultural items (such as coins) is MORE strict than ordinary property because of the WWII experience in stolen art. Stolen property legally remains the property of the owner and commerce with it is illegal. as far as the law is concerned, there is no sale when you purchase stolen property.

It doesn't help when the cops drag their feet and the hobby/industry doesn't cooperate. And they do not cooperate. They collaborate in the stolen coin market. They stall, hide the records, feign ignorance, and will only comply with the minimal efforts necessary under warrants and court orders. They do NOT open there records.

 

Three points on this:

First, this is not the issue. How one can secure a business or a home is irrelevant to this topic. If you want to really have a discussion about how one can go about making a business or a home more secure, you should start another thread on that topic.

Secondly, people who have coins stolen are the victims and not the perpetrators of crime. And they are blameless when someone else does a wontingly immoral act.

Thirdly, dealing in stolen goods and being laxed in the matter of commerce with stolen goods is ANOTHER crime.

What is relevant is that far too many coins are stolen and there is a mounting number of victims. And a laxed attitude about stolen coins in the market (not to mention stolen property), is fueling the crime. In fact, it is the primary cause for these crimes. It is just too easy to steal coins and then dump them on the market.

 

Even without a slab, a centalized database would make it quick and easy to essentially end dump stolen coins on ebay and the like.

 

Helter-Smelter, buyer beware...

 

Correct, the person whose coins are stolen is the victim. However, they can be blameless, or they can be totally to blame. If you don't take all necessary precautions to secure your property, you are at fault through negligence.

 

modern figerprinting with AI.

 

Hi

I work with a MAJOR metropolitian museum and do a LOT of work with stolen at and I have their lawyers at my disposal. Without a doubt, the title of stolen property can not be transfered for coins.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2315
for starters.

https://popcenter.asu.edu/content/stolen-goods-markets-0

https://www.fsp-law.com/buying-stolen-property-some-cautionary-tales/

https://www.interpol.int/Crimes/Cultural-heritage-crime/Stolen-Works-of-Art-Database

https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2019/06/returning_stolen_artwork.html

https://ifar.org/stolen_art_alert.php

You shouldn't think for a minute that if you buy a stolen item that you own it.

 

https://www.numiis.com/coin-checker/
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/09/technology/facial-recognition-software.html

 

I don't see any reason why not. Facial recognition is much harder than coins, and most people have that built into their cellphones now. Every coin can be finger printed.

 

Solution is both. Safe and identification.

 

I never suggested this person wasn't a victim, or that they deserved someone stealing from them. HOWEVER people stealing other people's stuff was written about in the bible, it's not ending anytime soon, so either prepare for the worst case, or roll the dice I suppose.

I looked up the address for this company, it comes back as inside a big office building with a union bank on the first floor. This is "Mint State Gold" right?
I wonder if they robbed the bank too while they were at it, I bet not.

people steal things from other people all the time. I myself have had firearms shoved in my face at 3 different times in my teen years by "robbers" before I figured out to stop being the victim and be proactive instead of reactive. it's just too easy to steal anything when there's almost no security to prevent it from happening or you "look" like a good target. the easier you look as a target, the more likely they are to feel froggy and jump because that's what they are, bottom feeders.

As far as the part of the discussion here about buying stolen property, if you KNOWINGLY bought stolen property it's criminal you can be charged.
However if you UNKNOWINGLY bought stolen property you likely won't get charged for it, but you will have to return it to the rightful owner of it. Your only recourse would be to go after the person that sold it to you and file for restitution against said criminal to get your money back from that person.
If you do not agree to return the item after being notified that it is stolen, then at that point you can be prosecuted as it makes you a thief and knowing you have stolen goods on your hands.

 

Just ask the family that had the 1933 gold double Eagles.

 

It is not mentioned - BUT did the victim have his collection in a safe? If not, WHY. Did the victim have insurance on his business? Again, if not, WHY.
It is a shame he lost his coins and we all can learn from this: IF YOU HAVE A COLLECTION YOU HAVE WORKED YOUR ASS OFF FOR, I HOPE YOU HAVE IT INSURED AND IN A SAFE OR SAFETY DEPOSIT BOX. If not you are asking for headaches.
Semper Fi