Can we trust current slab coins?.

I recently paid about $100 for an NGC MS70 "first strike" slabbed coin that is in reality worth about $17 - $18. But I did so hoping that in a few years there will be someone else out there willing to pay even more for a slabbed coin that has this label. Stupid? Maybe. Only time will tell.

 

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Care to say what kind of coin you bought? Was it an MS70 ASE by any chance? Would it have been cheaper to send it in and pay NGC grading fees yourself? even if slightly less than $100? If so, you may have less time to wait to hope to realizee a return on your costs, but it seems more than likely you'll be waiting a LONG time either way.

 

Asking because I don't know. Not trying to make a point here.

Is "Buy the coin, not the slab" the same as "Make your own judgment about the grading", or is it different?

And coin grading is a demanding skill that takes time and practice to learn?

So here's the key question, which I'm afraid to ask because it sounds like an argument:
Assuming that some future version of me has spent many leisure hours learning to evaluate coins, why would I trust my own judgment over that of someone who's been doing it 8 hours a day for years?

 

Buy the coin and not the slab is not the same as " make your own judgment on the grading." It means do your homework. Buy the book before the coin. If you are unable to trust your own judgment then you might want to practice more.All over these boards you have opportunities to grade coins and challenge what you know. Many of these coins are graded, so you will know how well or how much practice you need. As to graders spending 8 hours a day grading, exactly. How precise or consistent are you from the beginning to the end of your shift?

I know that it can get frustrating and at times over whelming but in the end you will have a better collection for it.

 

From reading other parts of this board, do I understand right that there are desirable and undesirable properties of a coin that aren't part of the grading standards? So that even if two coins had the same grade and everyone agreed on it, one of the two could still be preferable?

 

On the subject of trusting the TPG's
On the whole yes we can trust the top tier TPG's to do as good a job as can be done at this time. Yes grading is subjective. It takes quite some time to learn to do it right.
This hobby has many aspects to it and as many different ways to collect coins as there is collectors. Grading is one aspect to the hobby. And for those that do not want to learn how to grade to a level where they feel comfortable purchasing a hundred or two hundred dollar coin on their grading skills, The TPG's allow them the comfort to know they are not wasting their money on a grossly over-graded piece. That way they can continue to enjoy the hobby.
Example: I have been riding motorcycles since 5 years old, My uncle use to collect Harley's The part of the motorcycle experience he enjoyed was actually working on the as much as riding them. Me I just like riding and do not care at all to learn how to tear a motor apart, just basic work on them.
And there are others that do not even want to learn to do basic maintenance on their bikes. They go to the shop every spring to Professionals that do that every day. And they still enjoy riding.
I took a year and taught myself to grade coins and that was just two years ago that I finished, until then I had a general knowledge of grading I had learned back in the 70's But was not until a couple of years ago that I wanted the challenge of teaching myself to spot grade(Ability to grade a coin in under 60 seconds for visiting coin shows) but this time did not come until I was able to set aside 3-4 hours a day to learn this a lot of people do not have that kind of time to devote to lerning to grade yet they still want to enjoy the hobby

Just my 2c and probably worth just that

I Just ENJOY our great hobby and the great PEOPLE:hail:

Stewart

 

They don't even look at these before a grade is assigned

They don't even look at these before a grade is assigned - the modern silver eagles are done with a computer in bulk on a assembly line and they are all MS-68, 69 or 70 - it's a joke IMO.
There is no challenge on modern mint products. On real coins such as classic U.S. series in grades below VF comes the real work and anyone can (with enough practice) become a good coin grader.
Your judgement, (or mine) can be trusted because you will learn what pleases you and brings you enjoyment of the hobby - No TPG company can give you that.
By the way, silver eagles graded MS or PR-69 are common as the day is long and bring no preimium over raw coins in the wholsale market, somtimes less. Same for modern commems, no added value.

 

I thought it was common knowledge how else could they

I thought it was common knowledge how else could they grade all the monster boxes dealers submit trying to get the coveted MS-70.

I don't have a souce right off but again I think I have read it many times in Coin World, etc.
Someone else know of this???????????

 

I never heard that before, and would be interested in a source.

 

I'll look for it.

I'll look for it.

 

As far as I know none of the major services have used or tried to use computer grading since 1991.

 

I know of a large dealer who will remain nameless who somehow knows how many eagles are going to come back in a certian grade BEFORE they send them in. This is directly from the source and they send in a LOT of eagles.

 

That's interesting. It sounds like the grading is negotiable ahead of time if you submit enough coins.

 

I also know a big dealer who says the same thing.

I also know a big dealer (or three) who says the same thing.

 

Getting with the program

I'm curious. What was attempted with computer grading?

Myself being a "selector" and not tempted to become a serious coin buyer, I'm curious about the concept. Sometimes I find a coin and decide to keep it, ie, not spend it at face value. Some of my stack include gold passed through the family. That's special.

I have "invested" in a few SAE's because they are "pretty" to me and are my PM backup. None are slabbed.

Since finding this Board I've learned a great deal about the difference between the way folks look at coins. Some collect, some hunt, some horde, some sort & and roll search & some invest.

It's all good!:thumb:

But having a computer determine what a coin is worth is kinnda beyond the fun level to me.

Reading some of these threads about grading leave me thinking about that poor fellow in Florida looking for hanging chads. It's just tedious when it gets to that.

What was the computer supposed to do? Tell you that you want it?
:rolling:

 

The computer cannot tell what it's worth just grade it -

The computer cannot tell what it's worth just grade it - those are two very different things - as I have said in this town a set of silver eagles graded MS-69 will bring no more or even less than a raw set of very nice ones.
Remember IMO, MS-68 or 69 on coins that are all MS68, or 69 and are produced to be that grade overall is a joke that have the TPG company laughing and running to the bank with all the money.

 

i hope in the near future. man can invent a magic machine that can grade all the new modern coins fast and accurately. so that the u.s. mint can use that machine and process all the coins and sell it directly to collectors. collectors can select ms-68, ms-69 and ms-70 with different price tag. this also apply to proof version. no more middlemen, professional graders, dealers involve. cool. isn't it?. and the mint also set up offices that deal with buy and sell. mint buy back from us and sell it to others. mint make money. and make things easier for us.

 

I guess the only un~cool thing would mean all those unemployed middle men would then show up on my front porch to sell me lighting rods and magazines subscriptions.:kewl: