Fee-bay . . . the Rest of the Story!

I won't argue with that at all. Ebay pulls the "we didn't know" trick too often.
"We don't know" means we don't care until enough people bring it to light and even then they don't care. They have that built in cover basically.
Instead of spending money to hire people to scrutinize auctions for authenticity I'd be willing to bet they have a FINE team of lawyers.

TV is different of course. They just blatantly rip people off with real coins (for the most part). Lots of fine print but it's there.

I'd love to see them all banished but it won't happen. Still, it's a nice fantasy.

 

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I can see contact marks on each that do not appear on the other. I don't think they're the same. The "toning" on the 1893-O does look a little strange but I don't think it's covering up a modified 1898-O.

 

I think you are right. The 1898-O appears to be VAM 24 which has a very high tilted O mint mark which the second one does not have. The 1893-O still looks fishy though. dd:

 

I see (Something like this) all the time... But always boils down to one thing, (Prove it)...

What would take Ebay down? If people would refuse to buy from them... What will keep Ebay alive? All the newbies that go there every day and buy from them...

I have had people coming into my shop and complain that they got taken by a shop down the street only to see them go right back to that shop next month....

They do not care if they get taken, all they know is that, that shop is cheaper (Or has better lip service) than your shop....

You can try.... You can try... But sometimes there is no help for the ignorant....

 

I reduced the original pic (1898-O) down to the same size as the 1893-O and circled just 3 identical marks as the 1898-O to show they are one in the same, besides the fact you can see the 3 has been tooled. Plus, someone said something about marks on the 1893-O that weren't on the 1898-O? Marks can easily occur during the tooling process (accident) but it's hard to remove marks, so the proper way to compare the two is to find identical marks from the supposed original coin that are on the 2nd coin, not the other way around.

Ribbit

Ps: I added a 1893-O & 1898-O obverse pic for comparison purposes.

 

I really do not understand why anyone would spend more than $20 on a coin without a return policy in the first place. What if ebay required a return policy on all numismatic related purchases, or even all purchases? Until that happens, I WILL NOT buy coins on ebay; period. It may not completely solve the problem, but it would give everyone a chance to get a second opinion.

 

They do have similar marks but the MM is different.

 

What you are seeing is an optical illusion. :goofer: The 2 pics were taken at different angles and if you take that into consideration, then the mint marks match up and the little pimple looking thing above the eagle's right wing tip helps to finish it off.

Ribbit

Ps: The buyer sent it off to PCGS and he told me he'd let me know what they say. :secret:

 

Well for starters how about better than 95% of the material I collect does not come slabbed, and it is esoteric enough that about the only way I can find any of it is through eBay. Oh and most of the 5% that does is common stuff that I either don't want or already have.

 

Maybe when we find these fakes we should report them to the Secret Service along with our email to eBay. I don't think I would inform eBay of this arrangement though.

http://www.ustreas.gov/offices/domestic-finance/acd/if-you-suspect.shtml

This action would clearly make the US Secret Service aware that eBay is basically acting as agents for these frauds.

Most of us at CT are better then the government professionals at spotting fakes, the only real problem is as soon as you do something along these lines, you set yourself up for some serious scrutiny by the Feds.

On second thought , maybe I'll just avoid all of the above.....eBay, the Feds, etc....

 

Note that the link relates to paper currency only. The Secret Service has little interest in counterfeit coins, and practically no interest whatsoever in counterfeit collectible coins. They want the "big fish", not the minnows. I think the real problem is fraud, i.e., selling known forgeries as genuine. That's how you attack the problem... with criminal prosecution. But... easier said than done.

 

Garrett I'll have to agree with Toad on this one the MM are too similar and as to 2 coins havinging the same marks being sold at close to the same time is miniscule at best , IMO THESE ARE THE SAME COINS , for me only certified coins or coins that the seller has a good return policy on fleabay anymore .
rzage

 

You could try , but IMO THE Secret Service doesn't care enough about this fraud .
rzage

 

Secret Service oversees counterfeit currency. I believe it's the FBI that wants the coin counterfeiters.

 

Well they dont do a very good job at it!

 

i will tell you whats wrong with it almost everyone is looking to get their 1000$ coin for 10 bucks but when the flipside happens people run out screaming crook, cheat.

 

On the following auctions, all from the same seller, they were all reported to Ebay by numerous peeps and well before they ended, yet today, they are still active and have ended with some poor smuck being defrauded, because all of them are stolen pic auctions:

1874-S TD:

http://cgi.ebay.com/1874-S-Trade-Dollar-XF-AU-Details_W0QQitemZ280322096771

http://cgi.ebay.com/1874-S-Trade-Dollar-XF-AU-Details_W0QQitemZ320348220420

1876-S TD:

http://cgi.ebay.com/1876-S-Trade-Dollar-Choice-BU-Blast-White_W0QQitemZ280322097703

http://cgi.ebay.com/1876-S-Trade-Dollar-Choice-BU-Blast-White_W0QQitemZ310126455370

1877-S TD:

http://cgi.ebay.com/1877-s-Trade-Dollar-Almost-Uncirculated_W0QQitemZ280322099064

http://cgi.ebay.com/1877-s-Trade-Dollar-Almost-Uncirculated_W0QQitemZ270353784495

1875-CC TD:

http://cgi.ebay.com/1875-CC-Trade-Dollar-CHOICE-UNCIRCULATED-NICE-NICE_W0QQitemZ280322102658

http://cgi.ebay.com/1875-CC-Trade-Dollar-CHOICE-UNCIRCULATED-NICE-NICE_W0QQitemZ270352665054

1859-O SLD:

http://cgi.ebay.com/1859-O-Seated-Dollar-AU-Sharp-Details_W0QQitemZ280322093655

http://cgi.ebay.com/1859-O-Seated-Dollar-AU-Sharp-Details_W0QQitemZ130291200673

1872 SLD:

http://cgi.ebay.com/1872-Seated-Liberty-Dollar-AU-RARE-COIN_W0QQitemZ280322100639

http://cgi.ebay.com/1872-Seated-Liberty-Dollar-AU-RARE-COIN_W0QQitemZ280318631908

1847 SLD:

http://cgi.ebay.com/1847-Seated-Liberty-Dollar-Toned-XF-AU_W0QQitemZ280322104822

http://cgi.ebay.com/1847-Seated-Liberty-Dollar-Toned-XF-AU_W0QQitemZ250383456838

1885-S Morgan

http://cgi.ebay.com/1885-S-MORGAN-SILVER-DOLLAR-RARE-KEY-DATE-PQ-GEM_W0QQitemZ280322094348

http://cgi.ebay.com/1885-S-MORGAN-SILVER-DOLLAR-RARE-KEY-DATE-PQ-GEM_W0QQitemZ140306189531

1889-O Morgan:

http://cgi.ebay.com/1889-O-Morgan-Silver-Dollar-RARE-High-Grade-PQ-GEM_W0QQitemZ280322096041

http://cgi.ebay.com/1889-O-Morgan-Silver-Dollar-RARE-High-Grade-PQ-GEM_W0QQitemZ350176092390

1893-P Morgan:

http://cgi.ebay.com/1893-P-Morgan-Dollar-Silver-Key-Date-1893P-SCARCE-Coin_W0QQitemZ280322101137

http://cgi.ebay.com/1893-P-Morgan-Dollar-Silver-Key-Date-1893P-SCARCE-Coin_W0QQitemZ260370448291

1888-S Morgan:

http://cgi.ebay.com/1888-S-Morgan-Dollar-Silver-Key-Date-1888S-SCARCE-Coin_W0QQitemZ280322101714

http://cgi.ebay.com/1888-S-Morgan-Dollar-Silver-Key-Date-1888S-SCARCE-Coin_W0QQitemZ220371045004

1884-CC Morgan

http://cgi.ebay.com/1884-CC-Morgan-Dollar-Silver-Key-Date-UNCIRCULATED-Coin_W0QQitemZ280322104296

http://cgi.ebay.com/1884-CC-Morgan-Dollar-Silver-Key-Date-UNCIRCULATED-Coin_W0QQitemZ260370446469

1884-CC Morgan:

http://cgi.ebay.com/1884-CC-Morgan-Silver-Dollar-Very-Fine_W0QQitemZ280322105463

http://cgi.ebay.com/1884-CC-Morgan-Silver-Dollar-Very-Fine_W0QQitemZ180334127557


What's even worse, the seller doubled up and is reselling the same coins (NOT):

http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/liaotian141

It's situations like this that Ebay should be on top of, considering the reports that went in, yet nothing was done. :goof: So I just contacted PayPal and now they will do something about it, since the buyers are paying with PayPal and many have already paid. :whistle:

Ribbit

 

How's ebay supposed to make any money with honest guys like HandsomeToad around? Thanks for watchin' out for us!

 

I'm not alone, there's a big group of peeps on the CFE Group that do a lot more than I dew. I just dew what I can. And on this group of listings, it all started with one of them being posted on CFE as a stolen photo and I researched the seller's other items to find the rest, since a seller rarely steals just one photo. :whistle:

But what this should do is show you that when you are buying on Ebay, always check the seller's store to compare other pics to the one you want to buy, since they should all look similar. :kewl: If you do that, it will help to prevent you from being swindled.

Ribbit