Please critique my grading skills

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by sonlarson, Feb 17, 2009.

  1. sonlarson

    sonlarson World Silver Collector

    Picked this up from a dealers " bargin box". Graded as VF.
    The obverse appears to meet that grade, but appears to be weakly struck.
    The reverse appears to be somewhere between VF and EF.
    The price I paid was $25, which I feel was about right.

    Since I am trying to learn grading, I welcome any comments, good or bad. Gotta learn somewhere.

    Also comments on the photo. I am trying some new technique with lighting and camera setting I studied in Mark Goodman's book.
    Thanks
     

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  3. davidh

    davidh soloist gnomic

    I think you need a bit more lighting. Your photo is too dark and grainy to be able to tell much about the coin.
     
  4. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    The coin appears grainy because it is corroded.

    I agree with your estimates on grade, but because of the corrosion the coin would net grade to F IMO.
     
  5. Leadfoot

    Leadfoot there is no spoon

    The coin is either corroded, or the photo has been WAY over-sharpened -- or both.
     
  6. ryanbrooks

    ryanbrooks Active Member

    I would agree with it being corroded, although you should be able to get it off with a few safe meathods that some of the members have started a thread on :D Not a bad price by the way! :)
     
  7. kevcoins

    kevcoins Senior Roll Sercher

    the shield is very nice, it has full lines
     
  8. Leadfoot

    Leadfoot there is no spoon

    p.s. I agree with XF details.
     
  9. Cloudsweeper99

    Cloudsweeper99 Treasure Hunter

    Sonlarson, I think you're going to become a very good grader. You are obviously very careful and separately examined both sides. All you need to do is to keep at it.
     
  10. davidh

    davidh soloist gnomic

    I agree with the over-sharpening of the photo. The graininess is pretty uniform over the entire surface of the coin, even the high worn areas.
     
  11. sonlarson

    sonlarson World Silver Collector

    I did sharpen a bit using Paint Shop Pro, I used the color saturatation tool to try and get it as close to the actual color as possible. The graininess is no doubt from too much contrast adjustment or from reducing from the original size, which was quiet large. This is a little hard for me to do since I am color blind. This is a copy of the actual photo without any touch up except for size reduction. It still shows some of the graininess so there may be some corrosion. You would be grainy too if you were 144 years old.

    Thanks for all the responses and comments. I think learning is a fun process and you get to keep the coin.
     

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  12. Leadfoot

    Leadfoot there is no spoon

    The artifacts could be from the resizing or sharpening (contrast adjustment shouldn't cause it). Would you please post an unretouched/unresized photo at the originally-captured resolution? Thanks...Mike
     
  13. sonlarson

    sonlarson World Silver Collector

    No adjustments as requested...Also a Mike
     

    Attached Files:

  14. Leadfoot

    Leadfoot there is no spoon

    I think I was right the first time -- corroded and oversharpened (likely through sharpening AND resizing).

    You see how there's a "roughness" to the fields of that coin? That's the corrosion.

    Now compare them to the surfaces on this coin:

    [​IMG]

    You see how the above coin is "smooth"* and your coin is "rough"? That's the corrosion.

    Hope this helps...Mike

    * = you might notice a spot on the above coin at about 11:45 -- that's an area of old corrosion too! Very common on these old coppers.
     
  15. sonlarson

    sonlarson World Silver Collector

    It does help. Thanks

    Now the stupid question. What causes the corrosion, is there a cure, and does it distract from the quality or value of the coin? Keeping in mind I collect for enjoyment, not investment.
     
  16. Leadfoot

    Leadfoot there is no spoon

    There is no real cure to corrosion. You either try and stop it from actively growing (by removing the source of corrosion -- heat and moisture -- or coating the coin in certain types of preservatives [oil]) or you wear the coin down artificially to remove it then retone it in any number of ways.

    Unfortunately, it does affect the value of the coin -- generally the coin is valued at least one grade lower, and in more extreme cases, like your coin, two or more grades lower.
     
  17. Leadfoot

    Leadfoot there is no spoon

    p.s. for instance, I would grade your coin XF details, corroded, net F.
     
  18. sonlarson

    sonlarson World Silver Collector

    Which is the reason I found it in the bargin bin. More expierenced collectors simply passed it by. Don't plan on altering the coin, no reason to. It fills a hole in my type collection and I think I paid a price closer to a F coin than a Vf coin so I am OK there. This is my first "old copper", so I did learn something else to look for. Thanks for your time and patience... Mike
     
  19. Leadfoot

    Leadfoot there is no spoon

    Mike, Look at it like this -- if nothing else, you learned a very inexpensive lesson. :)

    Take care....Mike

    p.s. You are welcome -- happy to help....
     
  20. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    That should almost always be your first clue. With any coin, if it looks to be say X grade and yet it is priced at a lower grade - there is almost always a reason for it. Just because you don't readily see that reason doesn't mean it isn't there.
     
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