Here's another thread I alluded to as part of an earlier post: I have listened, read, and wrung my hands over the current scourge of coin collecting: cleaned coins. While I recognize the need for sound grading/technical evaluation (particularly on high-end coins), I would like to voice my opinion for the majority of us "regular Joe" individual collectors. Of course, seeking feedback based upon your perspective. Coins that have been harshly cleaned are fairly easy to detect. Forgetting about value, they generally don't look good. They don't "belong" in the set when side-by-side with the others, even in circulated grades. However I think there is too much fussing over "wiped" coins. Not dipped, scoured, or whizzed...just likely been wiped over well with a cloth at some point in the past. They are a bit "shinier" than a coin that's been left in a box for 50 or 100 years. For relatively common dates, circulated grades, I think there's too much fretting over this. Many numismatic experts believe that up to three-quarters of "old" coins were "cleaned" at some point. Some retone to a degree. Some less so. I read about guys ponying up $30 fee to get a $50 coin graded, and I wonder about it. What do you think? Maybe the grading services are doing a good marketing job? I have never had anything graded unless I thought it was worth well over $200: 1909S VDB, 1914D or 1922P Lincolns, 1916D, 1921PD Mercury, not even my 1921PDS Walking halves. Do you think that what I'm calling "wiped" coins (which arguably may be rare or a huge majority of the silver collectibles out there depending on who you ask), are being made too big a deal? Recognize this is a personal point of view questions of course, but just thought I'd ask. If so inclined to respond, it might be nice to know your level and time at this great hobby. Perhaps some sagely advice will work its way in.....
A coin can be wiped with no hairlines. I suspect a soft cloth could do it. Years ago no one made too much a deal about this. It's more recently (and with the advent of so many grading services) that even a wiped coin has become of issue.
Well I agree - but if you have hairlines then some people will say damaged. I do think on the higher end coins, even with a soft cloth you might impact the luster and lower the grade on the coin. I think on VF on down - probably not much impact. In my opinion the tpg's are not consistent will calling a coin cleaned. There have been some pretty nice coins posted that were body bagged as cleaned. In my opinion there was nothing harsh about the cleaning - based on the pictures. To me, the older the coin the more likely you will see a cleaned coin(and or damaged coins) slabbed by PCGS/NGC. Specifically thinking about bust coinage. I also think they let more semi-key/key dates slip thru to get slabbed. My opinion only. I also have no problem if someone wants to spend $30 to get a $50 dollar coin slabbed. At least slabbed the buyer feels more confident about the grade. Just my opinion.
The way I see it is, it only matters what the buyer or owner thinks of the coin, and if they are satisified with it, then so be it. Everyone has their own likes and dislikes, after all, we are not robots.......or are we?....lol. :goofer:
I will no doubt never be a great coin collector to a lot of people because I mainly operate on two very simple measurements. They are very simple and consist of: 1. I like the coin's eye appeal. I'll admit the "eye appeal" includes many things (stike quality, boldness, any signs of harsh cleaning, what I think the grade is, and a few others.) 2. I think it is priced right and I can afford it. After saying that it is okay because it is my collection and my money being spent. If you like "wiped" coins then buy them or wipe them yourself. You are not collecting for anyone else but you. Coin collecting is very subjective, you see posts here of coins with pictures and people will disagree on the grade and if it has been cleaned or not. And these are people disagreeing that I have come to really respect their opinions and their knowledge on coins. I will always be a "regular joe" collector because of cost. But what helps me get the most bang for my buck is patience. I am very happy and proud with my collection. Have I made a few errors along the way? Sure I have.
No, no coin can be wiped without leaving hairlines. And I don't care how soft the cloth is. And anyone who thinks they can do so is mistaken. Even though the untrained eye may not see them - the trained eye will see them. Even on low grade circulated coins the hairlines created by the wiping are going to be there. But as Mark said, there won't be much impact; 1 - because there are usually so many on circ coins anyway that you won't really notice them and 2 - a few more hairlines on a circ coin is not going to lower the grade any. There have long been 2 schools of thought on this. For centuries it was thought to be perfectly accpetable to take a cloth and polish your coins up all bright and shiny. But the closest I can pin it down is that sometime in the early 20th century collectors and numismatists began to realize that doing this destroyed the mint luster on a coin. They realized that polishing or wiping their coins with a cloth left marks and destroyed the originality of the coin. Based on the experience of my own family, by the 1930's there was an ever growing group among collectors who advocated not cleaning their coins with harsh or improper methods. That group has since grown until today it is by far the majority, and those who think that wiping a coin with a cloth or using harsh cleaning methods is OK is the minority.
