in another thread, someone mentioned "coins that are commonly faked". is there a list somewhere of what coins are commonly faked? is there a way i can tell a fake from the real thing?
You will receive many good replies to your question here at CoinTalk. I might suggest that you learn about some of the different counterfeiting techniques and some of the characteristics of counterfeit coins. This way, you will be able to detect a suspect coin before you buy it. The ANA offers correspondence courses & counterfeit detection is part of the curriculum. Most experienced collectors can look at a case of coins & pick out some bad coins at a glance. Basically, if a coin doesn't look right to you, then you may want to pass on it. Some counterfeits are very well made & they are very difficult to detect. Keep an eye on some of the counterfeit coin photos posted here on CoinTalk. Basically, if there is money to be made by counterfeiting a particular coin, then someplace there is probably a counterfeit. Some counterfeits are old & some are new. There are some countries in this world where it is not illegal to manufacture the coins of a different nation. Very best regards, collect89
"Coin World" just had a 2 part article about counterfeiting coins, they interviewed a man in China that does it. He's able to get away with it because it doesn't violate some of the laws they have.
These days it seems like there are many common dates being faked. There has always been 1909-S VDB and 1914-D Lincoln's and 1916-D Mercury Dimes being faked because of their value. But, with the Chinese counterfeiting operations, it seems like they are faking fairly common dated silver dollars. In the past, you had to worry about key date coins...but now China is doing a ton of dates. It's kind of sad.
Any coin that has numismatic value may be counterfeited. Some are counterfeited more than others. Some of these are: Trade Dollars $2 1/2 & $5 Indians $3 Gold Many genuine coins are altered to appear to be a more valuable date or mintmark. This may be accomplished by altering the date, adding a mintmark, changing a part of the coin (e.g., removing the leg on a 1937-D Buffalo Nickel), etc. Some of these are: 1856 Flying Eagle Cent 1909-S VDB 1908-S & 1909-S Indian Head Cents 1914-D Lincoln 1922 Lincoln 1937-D 3-Legged Buffalo Nickel 1916-D Mercury Dime To answer your second question, you need to educate yourself. The ANA correspondence course that Collect89 mentioned is a good start.
If you are not already an ANA member & you want to learn more, go to www.money.org There are several tangible benefits of being an ANA member. One benefit is that you receive The Numismatist magazine each month. You can also borrow books from the ANA library. The first book I bought from the ANA store was a reprint from the Numismatist containing several articles describing some common & documented counterfeit coins. [This little 1/4" thick book is out-of-print today]. Very best regards, collect89
That's a pretty good book. Vol I is out of print and VERY hard to find but Vol II is still available from the ANA Bookstore.
Every coin there is has been counterfeited at one time or another. So no there is no list. yes you there ways to recognize a fake, but it takes a lot of learning - nobody knows it all. But size, weight, design are some of the first things to check.
Because of the activity of the Chinese, the list keeps growing. Since most of the modern counterfeits are higher end coins, buying them in slabs from the major TPGs now becomes a must. As GDJMSP said, "nobody knows it all." And I think I can expand that to nobody CAN know it all.
That sure doesn't seem to be the case so much anymore. It seems like the Chinese are cranking out pretty common dated Morgan's these days.
I sometimes think counterfeiting is becoming a fad or just for fun. There are reports of the Chinese making Silver Dollars with the exact same metal content as the real ones made here. Same with some Gold coins. Thier details are getting better all the time also. Some fakes are so bad it is really fun. For example I recently purchased a Walking Lib Half that was so horrible I just had to buy it. It was only on one side and made of Lead. A recent thing is to recoat the 1943 Steel Cent. Gee they sell for about $0.15 each after that. Of course there are probably millions of Copper plated 43 cents out there. I've got several of those. Ever hear about that guy that was making the counterfeit $1 bills some years back and he even mispelled Washington. Counterfeits and fakes are starting to become a hobby themselves and at coin shows some are selling for more than the originals.
Nothing recent about this. A friend of mine bought a gorgeous looking PDS set. Must have been 30-35 years ago. The new zinc coating made them look proof. They were called "reprocessed" back then. These were sold as "reprocessed"; no attempt to fool the buyer. But then they would not have fooled anyone except a total novice.
I look at it this way, if the Chinese eventually get so darn good at making a fake that the best TPGs out there can't determine a fake from a real one by examining the coin through a microscope or scale than I say where is the harm? If the Chinese perfect making fakes to the point that I just mentioned than this will put more coins on the market making them more abundant and thus more affordable to more collectors and not just the elite who can afford the big keys. If no one can decipher fake from real than again I say, where is the harm? It is totally psychological, as long as you don't know it's fake than in my opinion having a fake in your collection that you and everyone else believe to be real is just fine. Now, take note that I wrote in the future tense in the above paragraph. As far as I can tell the Chinese still have quite a ways to go before they get to the point of making "super coins", atleast with their silver and gold fakes. I say that because I've seen Chinese sellers show pictures of weighing their 90% silver coins and the weights have all been far off.
If I understand the Coin World article correctly, you are correct. It WILL take a to fool even the experts. Basically the take a real coin, digitize it at a high resolution, correct the digital file of irregularities, then create the die. But there will be certain diagnostic "marks" that will be common for all the coins struck from that die. The type of marks that wouldn't occur on US Mint coins. After seeing the same mark over and over, the experts will have found the incriminating "smoking gun". I think. Good thing I've got a stamp collection that will keep me occupied while this gets sorted out.
Didn't one of the slabbers recently find that some Morgan dollar variety, one that they had been slabbing as genuine, was actually fake?
I haven't heard of a variety that was slabbed as genuine being fake. But, I'm sure there have been a couple counterfeits slabbed over the years. I seem to remember reading about one with PCGS. It does happen, the TPGs aren't perfect. But, they do have a policy of buying coins back.
PCGS slabbed several "Small O" Morgan Dollars before discovering that they were fakes. They quietly bought them back from the owners (as part of their guarantee) and no longer grade "Small O" varieties of certain dates. I'm sure one of our Morgan collectors here can give a list of the dates for the "Small O" fakes.
