Some things we never talk about...

I take things very literally, so without trying to create an argument, I would like to hear what "Mint State" means to you. Personally, I don't agree with allowing hairlines for a MS grade. My thinking with conserving is that a professional has taken a coin with something growing on it, excessive oxidation, some environmental condition and via some process has made the coin suitable to be enjoyed in the future. What's wrong with saying that the coin is not in a "Mint State" once the conservation process is done? BTW, my favorite grade is AU58.

 

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Someone gets a coin from the Mint, in mint state, and spills glue on it.

Someone else removes that glue by soaking in water or solvent.

How is the coin not mint state? What kind of wear has it sustained?

 

Because we're talking about grades and essentially no coin is actually mint state by your definition such as hit mark getting ejected not mint state, touched at all not mint state and so on. You're essentially saying to change grading from 1-70 to 1-58 as nothing can actually be mint state since every single coin gets touched or handled in some way after it was minted.

 

I think we've come to the point of disagreement that's important to me and the point I'm trying to make. You say mint state is a lack of wear. I'm saying mint state is more than that. To me it lost it's mint state status when someone spilled the glue on it. Or when it's been cleaned without creating wear.
It is fine with me if we disagree. I will look for coins that are original to me, not doctored in some way whether professionally or otherwise.

 

I'm okay with the coin being touched and put into a proper holder or slab. Not okay with wiping, dipping, etc. then calling it mint state. As I said to Jeff, I'll continue to look for original coins. I'm perfectly fine with you being happy with the coins you collect.

 

There's not really much of a difference, all of those things alter the "original mint state" of the coin from the strict standard you want in earlier posts. There was also the point made that if it was conserved properly people never really know which is true

Has nothing to do with that at all, you just cant try and redefine grading and not expect it to be pointed out

 

I guess you're right, I am trying to redefine grading. Here is from the NGC site for a MS 65 grade: "Well struck with moderate marks or hairlines."
When I buy a MS65 graded coin (a gem), I don't think hairlines are acceptable. I understand that the coin did not just pop out from the die press, yes someone has handled it a few times over the hundred or so years, but once you wipe it...

 

Iam trying to redefine grading. Here is from the NGC site for a MS 65 grade: "Well struck with moderate marks or hairlines."


This is not true grading this is market grading. Bag marks are acceptible. Hairlines should never be accepted in the mint state category.

 

Hi Pickin and Grinin, Yes, this is the point I've been trying to make, but for whatever reason I'm getting some flack. If you go to the NGC site and read their definitions for grading, you will see that hairlines are acceptable in most of the mint state categories. PCGS also allows hairlines for getting a mint state grade.

 

I've lost my hairlines years ago and am surely not mint state. But I do have some bag marks.

 

I'm just gonna go ahead and answer OPs question:

I throw out my used acetone after every use. The unwanted substance(s) removed from the coin is still in the acetone. It is just diluted. If you reuse it, the acetone will keep evaporating and the amount of foreign substance will keep increasing. You will be leaving an increasing amount of unwanted substance on every coin going forward. It is often suggested to use multiple acetone baths for this reason.

 

It's also worthwhile to point out again that "throw out" does not mean "pour down the drain". Diluted acetone probably won't kill your plastic pipes or their joints right away, but it certainly isn't good for them.

For the small quantities we use in conserving coins, it's fine to just let it evaporate outdoors. I put it into a metal can that I use for that purpose only. If there's a lot of it, I'll consider burning it, but that requires caution too.

 

That means there's up to 20% that have not been cleaned! I like those odds. Here's an example of what I like:

 

I think the coin dealers started this "do not clean" so they can say your coin is gunked up and lowball you, then "conserve" it and sell it for more. Lol, just kidding... a bit...

For real though, there's a lot of ways to improperly clean or conserve a coin that will damage it. Best advice is not to do it until you really know what you are doing and practice on some garbage coins worth face value or metal content only until you are quite certain on the results.

who hasn't ever messed up trying to clean or conserve a coin and ruined it in the process of learning how to do it?

 

To the OP's original question: For any coin with real value to you, whether financial or otherwise, you should always use fresh acetone. Once acetone has dissolved the contaminants, they are now present in the solvent; some as disassociated chemical compounds and some as particulates. When this contaminated solvent is re-used and the acetone evaporates from the cleaned surface, it leaves behind the particulates and some of the compounds.

This recommendation is not theoretical: I make high-precision machine tool parts and also do some amateur gunsmithing and use acetone regularly to clean parts prior to lay-out marking, bluing and painting. Used acetone always leaves a film. You may not see it on a coin but it's there. You can test this yourself. Take a shiny SS table knife and wash it with fresh acetone and then let it air dry. Observe the surface which will usually show a faint hint of film because even fresh commercial acetone is not 100% pure. Then wash the knife with used acetone. You will readily see the film left on the knife blade from the greater degree of contamination in the used acetone.

As for the re-use and disposal of used acetone: I reuse contaminated acetone for non-critical cleaning until its solvent properties are no longer effective. Normally, it evaporates before that point is reached. There are no real rules for when you should stop using it. For disposal, I just throw it on the shop's concrete driveway and let it evaporate, making sure it doesn't get into the soil. Any means of safe evaporation is the correct means of disposal. Acetone fumes are highly flammable so take due care.

 

And even if it does get into the soil, it won't stay there. It evaporates back into the air, gets diluted by rain, and gets broken down by existing microorganisms.

The stuff suspended or dissolved in it may be another story, of course.

 

what affect will acetone have on a proof penny?? will it fog it up, or change the color, i purchased a 52 proof, and like the coin for a defect it has (separate post), but the previous owner handled it wrong, and when i got it, walla...fp on obv and rev, so wondering if it will work or make it worse?? thanks for the input///

 

Acetone will not remove the fingerprint. I doubt that anything will without further damaging the coin but there are much more experienced people on the forum.