Counterfeit / Altered Coin Of The Day/Week

Great thread!

I've always wanted to become an expert gold authenticator. Especially on gold coinage.
I took an ANA Class, grading conservation and authentication with Brian Silliman at the phoenix pre semeniar show. It was only an 8 hour class of counterfeit detection, but I got to see hands on tons of fake gold coins. i also already knew a bit about counterfeit detection beforehand.

That $5 gold piece is pretty deceptive, where you have circles over the fields of the coin on some of them I cannot see what you are referring to. Are you referreing to depressions on some of them, because I can't see them..

I also thought that the toolmarks on the neck of the indian was further to the right of the neck, interesting.

Anyway, thanks for the great post.

 

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I have a 10 X loupe I use it,s a cheap one made in China , it's not strong enough for counterfeit diognostics , should I get a better brand or a more powerful loupe , what strength and make do most of you use .
rzage

 

Usually if I circle a general area it is pointing out weakness of the design/strike due to the counterfiet die. As for the tool marks -It really doesnt matter where the tool marks are ,each counterfiet is different to some degree- if we are talking about the same coin .

Now die polish should be fairly consistant on authentic pieces if that is what you may be thinking of.

 

Super interesting thread.

The question that comes to my mind is how many of these were made? I know it would vary greatly - you won't be making thousands of double eagles, but in the case of the 3 cent pieces, are there any ideas of quantity?

The next question is how astute is your average dealer to these fakes? If I see a 1860 3 cent piece at my dealers, can I trust that he knows the difference? (Of course, we're assuming he's not trying to unload a fake on me!!!)

 

I would figure most long time dealers are pretty astute , but even the tpgs get fooled , but rarely .
rzage

 

A GREAT and instructive thread, budgood, your photos are first rate! What struck me about this example was the overall mushiness and the irregular stars. The lettering also looked pimply. Was this item really gold, and designed to fool numismatists?

 

1889-cc, 'pretend' ANACS slab

Another eBay item, 110284048584 ,coin appears to be in a Coin World Slab with ANACS insert and being presented as ANACS authenticated. I would appreciate comments from the Morgan experts as to this item's likelihood of being authentic. thanks.

 

Nice find- that coin IMO is 100% fake . The CC is totally wrong in shape along with the date . Especially the 9.I also see what appears to be a serious recurring of the U in Plurinis. Bogus slab.... Not that you would think about bidding but Syltay away.

 

Prompt and strongly worded reports to eBAy, ANACS, by members of the Coin Forgery eBay group and I am sure others-- item is 'no longer for sale.' Thanks to all who helped. BTW, seller is a 'powerseller' specializing in 'key dates' andhas NO excuse whatsoever for allowing this auction to take place.

Listing can still be viewed by those interested, large photos have been provided making it instructive. In particular, read the wording of the listing, which in my personal opinion betrays intent to deceive.

 

And another one up for bid, from a different seller, who sold one just like it the other day.
140262840380 this one has been tagged as the 'spitting Liberty' fake for obvious reasons. Once again, problems with the 9 in the date. this also violates eBay authenticity disclaimers policy. If anyone agrees that this is a forgery, please report it to eBay. Thanks.

 

Took a month off -

Well the coin I chose today is a 1756 Spanish milled Pillar Dollar

Deceptive at 1st glance but there are many tells on this counterfiet.

1st off if you look in the fields & near some of the devices you will see some "slag" from the cast. I have circled some of the more noticible ones.
Next the overall surface has a very lite sanded look to it - This should be able to be seen in one of the close ups.

Finally the overall design is slightly crude with the denticles & rim really showing how badly it is.

It rings like silver & weighs in tolerance but most definately is not what the original buyer thought it was-

 

Nice to see you back , really missed this thread , with denticles so messed up do you think this was a hand made die ?
rzage

 

I see plenty of fakes in this series, it took me only a few minutes to find in my archives an example that looks remarkably like the one budgood is showing, except for the indentations on the rim:



This coin was sold on ebay as a replica in April this year.

 

Here's one I found on Ebay France:

http://cgi.ebay.fr/8-REALES-1741_W0QQitemZ220291055155QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item220291055155&_trkparms=39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A1%7C240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

It's more pathetic than the other two.

Ribbit

Ps: WB BG! :hail:

 

In fact, the authentic 1768 Santiago 8R has some large raised bumps on the reverse field, at least all those I've seen.

 

I agree 100% on that. I still believe the one I posted to be counterfiet . I guess I'm a bit "rusty" & left out the really good info you just posted on the other side of authentication.

 

I worded my question wrong , it's a cast copy , why are the denticles so messed up ?
rzage