I was looking on Ebay at 2007 Gold Buffalo Dollars. I noticed that in past auctions MS70 First strikes graded by NGC were selling for an average of $1035.00 whereas the PCGS graded MS70 First Strikes were selling at an average of $1400.00. Do PCGS always garner higher prices and if so why?
Yes, they generally do. As for why, it depends on who you believe. Some would argue PCGS is a stricter grader, others would argue that PCGS has the better marketing (and registry). As for me, in most cases I would call it ignorance on behalf of the buyer.
Here is the best answer I have seen (posted by The_Cave_Troll here -http://www.cointalk.org/showthread.php?t=33678&highlight=pcgs+registry&page=2
As I said in another thread about grading, this whole grading thing doesn't sit right with me. I'm 47 and sort of getting back into collecting and I have to say it was much more enjoyable for me 30 years ago without this whole grading game. Maybe it's me.. Anyway thanks for the reply. Brian
Brian: just as things were simpler 30 years ago, all things (esp grading and marketing) change. Welcome to the forum.
It isn't just you. It's a big time business now, not just a hobby. Ebay and TPGs are both a blessing and curse. I collect mostly circulated coins and bullion coins, so the whole super-high grading phenomenon doesn't impact my collecting very much. Regarding PCGS and NGC, the PCGS coins seem to sell for higher prices, but I've never seen a convincing argument that their grading is any more accurate. So you are better off selling a coin in a PCGS slab and buying a coin in an NGC slab. Or you can just buy raw coins and avoid the whole problem.
I agree with you 110%. Specially your last sentence. Hey Brian, I'm also 47 but haven't been collecting but for about 4 years. I agree with your comment about grading. It does sit well with me either. I'm working hard with in my means to learn to grade skillfully but keep running into this suggestive factor that the marketing of a coin will change its overall grade. Profiteers seem to be feeding on the inexperienced and as a result are fowling up the works for serious collectors. Its not you... Allen
The two companies have similar grading and similar pricing, with one glaring difference : NGC is MUCH more likely to award a 70 than PCGS. For this reason, PCGS 70s will trade higher than NGC 70s. Don't take my word for it. Go check their census figures. I did that a few months ago. With 2007 Proof ASEs, NGC awarded a perfect PR70DCAM 50% of the time. PCGS 17%. So perfect 70s are different. In the other 95% of the coin market, things are much, much closer. Again, don't take my word for it. Go check auction results. Yes, PCGS has a narrow lead*, but it's nothing like the 30% swing you observed in OP. * statistically insignificant, is my guess
Along those same lines, one expects the "70 factor" to disappear when pricing 69s*... and it does. I surveyed many dozens of ASEs on e-bay. I found that 2007 ASEs in PR69 DCAM brought $36.33 for PCGS, $34.44 for NGC. Very, very close. But PCGS charges more for slabbing.... * There are very, very few 68s or below from either service.
I hear ya. Knowledgeable people trust NGC. Someone trusted the Mickley specimen Class I 1804 S$1 to them. The recent Heritage auction brought $3.7 million ... in an NGC holder.
i must confess though that i personally like Ron Guth the big boss of PCGS he is a nice guy and of course so is David Lange so it doesnt really matter where i send them in they are not going to hit the market ever. BTW does anyone know anything about NCS coupons i have a sizeable order for them but the coins only have sentimental value so i was thinking of ways to do this cheap.
900fine, I never (to my knowledge) suggested otherwise. I certainly didn't intend it to be intepreted as such. To wit, the most expensive coin in my collection (up until I got a chain cent) was in an NGC slab, so I certainly don't discriminate with respect to slabs... Quite frankly, NGC slabs (particularly freshly-graded ones) can be a buying opportunity for those who know how to evaluate, grade, and price coins themselves, and "knowledgable people" don't "trust" grading compaines to grade coins -- or at least the knowledgable people I know -- they trust themselves. However, the tenor of the OP's question suggests that he's not quite there yet (not that there's anything wrong with that) thus my response. Respectfully...MIke p.s. I find it a tad bit ironic you chose an (in my opinion) grossly overgraded rarity and a coin which would likely sell for the same price if it were raw as your example.
Spock, From what I understand, that is simply not true, although I must concede that it depends on how you define the term "quota". Respectfuly...Mike
Submissions of coins to grading companies are often more about hopes or expectations for higher grades than they are about trust. And some of the ultra rarities have bounced back and forth between PCGS and NGC, ending up 1 or more points higher in the process.
it would be great to compare notes but what te grapevine has told me is that the graders have been instructed not to give out more than a certain number of ms 70's. so if you have heard something else or have a different perspective on quote i would like to hear it.
Spock, I believe you are wrong. Nothing I've read or heard suggests that's the case, and there are lots of people other than you, the grapevine, and I are watching. Respectfully...Mike
