Howdy fellow coin peeps, :thumb: I need help identifying the following two coins/tokens. :headbang: The 1863 coin/token may be from New Zealand but I'm not sure and the other coin/token is a total mystery to me. TIA! :hail: Ribbit
Can't identify the first one but the Arabic date on it is 1219... assuming that's an AH date that would make it about AD 1804. No idea if the coin/token is actually that old (it could be) but the date probably has some significance to the company that made it.
According to the last history of coins I read, Islamic countries in the Mideast avoided depicting any living creature, human or otherwise, on coins. So it would make sense that this would come from a country on the periphery of the Islamic world, or one that practised a more liberal brand of Islam than the fundamentalist Wahabism of Arabia.
You all have me going in the right direction. However, Malaysia wasn't called Malaysia in 1804 but rather, Sumatra. Here's a coin with the identical reverse but different obverse and the obverse has a "normal" date on it, which what someone said about 1804 appears to be correct. Now, I/we just have to find this specific coin and I'll/we''ll have one of the coins figured out. Ribbit
The reverse showing the roster is in my catalog for Malaysia Malacca and also under Indonesia, token issues but the obverse seems a bit different. Lou
Is that a rooster or something else? It doesn't have a crown like I'm used to seeing on roosters so I was thinking it might be a local bird of some kind? Ribbit Update - It's the fighting cock of the Malays. I found this in a Google Book - The Numismatic Chronicle By Royal Numismatic Society (Great Britain) (link below): http://books.google.com/books?id=Uns5wQft320C&pg=RA1-PA141&lpg=RA1-PA141&dq=1804+one+%22keping%22+sumatra+coin&source=web&ots=f1lvvu_QQM&sig=WRTsAPiHqHMh8WR4Cb17EUlxXTs&hl=en#PRA1-PA142,M1 It talks about this coin starting on page 141. I'm still reading but thought I'd update everyone that's watching this thread. 2nd Update - a picture of the rooster coin is on page 134 of the Google Book - The Numismatic Chronicle By Royal Numismatic Society (Great Britain) (click on link below): http://books.google.com/books?id=Un...iHqHMh8WR4Cb17EUlxXTs&hl=en#PRA1-PA134-IA1,M1
Here's a web site that list all the birds that are on coins: http://www.coinlode.com/list_birds.php Lou
The coins pictured are interesting (page 134). If I'm correct, on the second line of coins, #4 on the left side is paired with #4 on the right side but the coin we have here is the #4 on the left side paired with the reverse of #1, which on page 142 it does say that there are different pairings of the obverse & reverse so I guess this happens to be one of those different pairings. What say ye? :hammer: Ribbit
The coin is a keping from Malacca or Sumatra, dated, as stated above, AH 1219. Above the rooster is written, more or less, tanah malayuw (land of the malays). The reverse features a number at the top which looks like a 9, I guess this means '1', below written satu keping (one keping). There are numerous coins from many parts of the Islamic world which depict images of living creatures. This is true for nearly all of Islamic history. It just happens to be more of an exception than a rule.
We've figured out what the rooster coin is, now it's the other token that's unknown. I think it's a token and not a true coin so I doubt the World Coin Gallery would have it listed but I don't know anything about that "place" so a link would be helpful and I'll browse it to see if they have it listed. :hail: Ribbit Ps: My daughter is a ferret. She makes me take her to the park all the time so she can play in the rocks.
True enough, but there is plenty of Islamic coinage with portraiture on it, even today. Kemal Ataturk appeared on Turkish coins at the beginning of the last century, for example. Islam is like any other large religion - different strains that emphasize different ideas within the tradition. Islamic iconoclasm did not develop until two or three centuries after the death of Muhammed.
