2 Little Indians - Gold or Brass?

Howdy fellow coin peeps,

I recently bid on and won a 1926 $10 Gold Indian. I placed a low bid, not expecting to win it but after I did win, I looked closer at it and the information provided, and determined it was a fake/forgery. So, I did what anyone would do, I retracted my bid and asked the seller to offer it to the 2nd highest bidder, because it wasn't authentic.

Let me know if you think I did the smart thing or did I let an awesome deal get away from me?

Part One: Gold or Brass (aka: Deal-or-No Deal)?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150226869449&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fsearch.ebay.com%3A80%2Fsearch%2Fsearch.dll%3Ffrom%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm37%26satitle%3D150226869449%26fvi%3D1

Part Two:

I also bid on a 1910 $10 Gold Indian. I placed an even lower bid on this one because the pictures were really bad. I couldn't even tell it was an Indian, little lone 1910 and I could barely tell it was a coin. But the glare was sooooo bad, the fact gold was involved, was without question. However, the extent of gold is questionable (solid or plated).

So here's my second offering for you to determine - Gold or Brass (aka: Deal-or-No Deal)?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330221131863&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fsearch.ebay.com%3A80%2Fsearch%2Fsearch.dll%3Ffrom%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm37%26satitle%3D330221131863%26fvi%3D1

Ribbit,
Toad :smile

 

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i dont know enough about these coins to tell between real and fake. i would say the fiirst is definatly fake. and the second you cant really tell. but it is cheap enough that if it turns out to be real you are way ahead.

 

I certainly would not bid on those coins with such poor photos.

I think you may have found your CON-MAN.

 

I hear ya! :mouth:

I bid on these a few weeks ago and have learned since then, not to bid on coins with bad photos. But did you look at the first one and did you see the weight? You could easily say it was .5 grams shy of a full Indian.

Ribbit :smile

 

The color is off but that may be attributed to lighting or the white balance of the camera.

My Italian is poor but I can make out the weight of the coin is 16.2 grams as opposed to 16.718 grams for a genuine example. I would say that is a good clue the coin is not within US Mint specifications so it is very likely not 90% gold (assuming the diameter and thickness are within Mint specs). So perhaps the color of the coin in the photo is correct because it is not a gold coin. Who knows?

I think you have been had. Let us know when you get the coin.

 

I retracted my bid on that one. It's the second one I haven't retracted my bid on . . . yet. The seller seems a little reluctant to send it to me, so I may have to let him off the hook and let him cancel the auction.

Ribbit :smile

 

Hey toad. I can see by your purchases that you are a bargain hunter like me....hehe. Don't get down on yourself, you can find a decent "real" $10 Indian for under $500; but you are very wise to inspect the authenticity(i learned the hard way). Also check the return policy; translate the foreign language if you have to.

I got a nice clean "real" VF $10 Indian for $495, and I think gold was higher then than it is now.

John

 

The women folk think they're the best at bargain hunting but they've never seen a toad in action. :hammer: I run all over Ebay looking for good deals, and every now and then I manage to get one. My little $1 Gold Dollar is my best one so far, that I can confirm, but I've gotten some real good deals on other coins too and if I can ever manage to stop buying counterfeits, then I'll do even better. The things I've learned here have helped me spot quite a few counterfeits recently, including Part 1 below. I just wish I had joined earlier so I would have never bid on Part 1 but at least I caught it in time.

However, if the seller on "Part 2" sends me my Indian and it's real, then it will easily be my best bargain to date but I know if I had an Indian for sale and I only got a $5.00 winning bid on it, I wouldn't want to part with it so their "delay" is understandable and I may let them off the hook, even though I don't want to. Also, it's their delay that has me thinking it is real because cons move fast, no matter what the amount is, and this seller is seriously dragging their feet.

We'll see!

Ribbit,
Toad :smile

Ps: I know the rules on Ebay dictate the seller (Part 2) has to send me the Indian, but sometimes you have to forgo rules and do the right thing and that's probably this time . . . unfortunately.

Ribbit - Ribbit - Ribbit

 

Yeah, that second one would be a crazy ridiculous buy!! I wonder if you can turn down the contrast a little in photoshop and pull out a few of the details. Can you post a picture of your new $1 gold piece? I'd love to see it! I have two gold dollars(type 1 and 3), but they are both unfortunately damaged a bit. The type three is gorgeous but has an inward bend to it....sigh. My favorite piece would be my 2.50 classic head. John

 

It's already been posted. Look here:

http://www.cointalk.org/showthread.php?t=35371

It still hasn't arrived so I can't take new pictures yet but it should arrive soon and I'll post better pics then.

Ribbit

Ps: I got it for $150.00 - a real steal, since everyone else was bidding the gold price and I bid he coin.

Ribbit - Ribbit - Ribbit

 

pm sent

 

Replied! :hail:

Ribbit :smile

 

Just a suggestion if you are going to be buying gold coins, Bill Fivaz has an excellent book on gold counterfiet detection. I realize that eBay pictures will not allow you to fully look at the coin like you should, but it is still an excellent book to have, if you don't already. It has saved me a time or two.

 

Thanks for the info. :hail:

Ribbit :smile

 

HandsomeToad,

I applaud your aggresiveness with learning coin collecting and really getting into things. However, in my opinion, you are OUT OF YOUR MIND bidding on stuff like that on ebay (aka The Wild Wild West). Hang in there. Fortunately, you were able to retract your bid. Also, you might want to stay on this side of the pond and with reputable, well known sellers for now. Sometimes people get bargains...most of the time they get taken. You said that you have already learned a lot, so that is great!

 

I have learned a lot! I'm a serious newbie to Ebay but it didn't take long to learn!

Ribbit :smile

Ps: I'm re-learning coin collecting after being inactive for more than 25 years.

 

Hey, that's great! I'm very happy to have you on board at CoinTalk. We've been without a resident amphibian for some time now. :hail:

Oh, and I love your avatar!

 

Did you translate the second auction? I saw something I questioned so i did and I was right. Here is the translation of the important section.

 

Great catch!

I always look for "kopie" but they used a different word (I just went and translated the page too). I have to figure out what word it was so I can put it on my mental list to watch out for, plus, I will have to start translating the pages before I bid since the copies can easily look like originals, especially the minature ones. Without a point of reference, there is no way of telling how big a coin is.

Very valuable lesson learned!

Ribbit :smile

 

I am not sure on either.

BUT, from what the second auction says......

ACHTUNG es ist nicht die Original 10 Doller Goldmünze ( das Riginal ist natürlich schwerer und viel größer ), diese ist natürlich wesentlich kleiner und leichter, halt ein Nachlaßstück über das ich nicht mehr Angaben machen kann.

Something to the effect of...

WARNING this is not the original $10 Gold (the original is naturally "schwerer" and "viel" bigger), words in quotes I am not sure of.

Its been a few years since high school german, and even then I didnt pay too much attention.

I do not think that it is real.

Besides, don't you think that the actual germans that are browsing ebay.de would be able to read the auction and see that it is gold priced for a few dollars? It seems to me that even though there is a wild swing with prices on ebay, people generally bid on valuable items....and tend to stay away from the worthless junk.

Good Luck



.....I know no italian, but I would gamble on the first auction you listed before the second



I just found this. http://translate.google.com/translate_t