1916-P Buffalo Nickel - is it???

I edited the picture of the Obverse and attached a picture showing mainly the Date! I don't know if it will be much better but there is definitely and extra loop of a "6" extending from inside to South of the Primary "6" in the Date. There also appears to a loop of a "9" between the Primary loop and (i.e. inside the curl) tail of the "9".

I am thinking that it could be another 1916-P Buffalo Nickel DDO Variety (not the big one) but there was a feeble attempt by a Mint Employee to remove (grinding and polishing out) the Secondary Doubling and evidence still remained when the coin was struck (Minted)!


Frank

 

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With the roller marks (or whatever this type of marks are called) it makes it difficult to see exactly what is "going on" but I will have this in my possession shortly and will take a much better photo of the date and post it so it can be seen better. But there is something going on and like you said, it's not the full blown DD. I'm going to call it the "Poor Mans 1913-P DD" when I list in on Ebay to resell it. Not many people can afford the real thing but they can afford the next best thing, which will be this coin.

Ribbit

 

The image I used was only to show what strike doubling looks like.

It's not a repunched date and only worth the same as a normal coin would be.

The price guides have many doubled die and repunched dates listed.
Coins with just strike doubling are never listed and have no premium.

 

Here are 2 pictures. One a blow of this this coins date and the other of a certified doubled from Heritage. Although I can definitely see something going on with this coin, it is obvious to me that it is not the same doubling as the certified coin.

 

I'm going to see what info I can find online because I would have thought the earlier coin qualified as a repunched version (1866 Shield Nickel). This all sounds so confusing but I know once I read up on all of it, it'll make sense because if it doesn't, I'll probably go mad. :headbang:

Ribbit :smile

Ps: I played a little with the pic too and cut out most everything but the date.

 

Great job on the blow-up! And I agree it isn't as profound. When I get it in hand and a better picture, we'll be able to better define it but I doubt it will be a true DD. However, it will be the next best thing.

Ribbit :smile

 

Okay - now I see something in the loop. Good job RLM. By the way seelink here - I thought there was one mentioned on this board. I hope it works out and I can't wait to see some better picks.

 

I too see an extra loop in the six. It is very interesting.....

 

While the Secondary Date is shifted Southeast of the Primary date on the 1916-P DDO #1, the Secondary Date on Handsome Toad's Nickel is shifted South Southwest and appears slightly rotated!


Frank

 

I would hold off on any decision to list the coins as a "Poor Man's Double Die"! Wait until you get the coin and have posted some new pictures of the Date and have gotten some opinions before you decide. If I am seeing what I am seeing, then I do not believe that it is a "Poor Man's Double Die" by any means as the shift in the Secondary date from the Primary date is too great.


Frank

 

Man, looks like there is something too, can't tell if it is strike doubling or not, but it does look like something is there. Best of luck to you man! :thumb:

Phoenix

 

Are you sure those are roller marks?

I see this streaky toning on nickel coins from this period all the time. I always thought it was just the impurities of the copper-nickel alloy and toning.

Curiously yours...Mike

p.s. interesting coin, but I have nothing to add on the date/die...

 

I called it Roller Marks only because I don't know what else to call it. I know it is somewhat common (seen it on several Buffalos over the years) and the only thing I've found to define it is Roller Marks. I've been hoping someone here would be able to explain what this is called and what causes it, but no luck so far.

What I do know is it is pre-mint condition because the streaks are consistent, even on the edge of raised surfaces (bust/lettering/etc). So it has to be in the milling process of the planchet and probably identical/similar to what causes Roller Marks. That’s why I posted the definition of Roller Marks, because they have (at some time) changed their hypothesis as to what causes roller marks and it somewhat fits to what is occurring with my nickel, although roller marks on silver coins don’t look anything like the marks on my nickel.

Ribbit :smile

 

buff..............

http://www.coin-gallery.com/cgstanton3.htm

 

Very informative but I think I'm going to have to read it several times for it to sink in. However, they called everything "doubled die" with different variations and Idhair said:

Doubled strike, strike doubling and doubled die are three different things.

I need to figure out if that article covered what Idhair talked about or not, so maybe they will read it and let me know? However, I think that article may have only covered Doubled Die (all variations) and not Doubled Strike or Strike Doubling. Which, those two remind me of George Carlin’s Class Clown skits (you can double your strike but don’t strike your double). :mouth:

Ribbit :smile

 

Great reading. JT is the guy that wrote the Cherrypickers Guide.
The book has much more on the topic.

 

Can you tell me if Doubled Strike or Strike Doubling is covered in that article, Idhair?

Ribbit

 

The book Cherrypickers Guide Forth Edition Volume One has about 40 pages of text and images on the topic. It's a great book to own.
Bill Fivaz and J. T. Stanton did a great job putting this together.

I need to correct something I posted before.
When I used the term Doubled Strike, I was wrong.
The correct term is double-struck.
This is where the same die hits the coin more than once.
I'll double check my words next time.

 

Does that book have all coins in it, or are there different books for different coins?

 

What??????

Both Editions are about coins (U.S. coins that is!)! I cannot remember what the Volume or Edition Numbers are but the first book concentrates on everything from Half Cents to Nickels and the second book concentrates on Dimes to Dollars. Since neither book has every Error or Variety of U.S. Coinage (actually they only concentrate on the more sought after Errors and Varieties) listed, you have to purchase an extremely large assortment of books that either reference Errors, Varieties, specific denominations or Series of coins and some on specific Series of coins along with errors and varieties that occur on them.


Frank